IWAN, HBO is in the television business and show boxing because it is in their best economic interests. They are basically the money men, and the promoters and the other entities involved do the rest.
I dont think HBO wants to deal with the headaches of promoting fights directly, and I also dont think they want to tell Arum, King, Main Events, and others how to run their business. Some of you guys dont seem to understand that a lot of promoters assume financial risks for their boxers unless/until they contend for a title or become a big enough draw.
I think a lot of people would take issue with your "skim" statement. Promoters often give a guy five figures or more up front as a signing bonus before the guy even boxes a round for them. Is the boxer "milking" the promoter by taking money before he has ever even fought for the guy? no. It is part of the business. And as for HBO skimming off the top, the Feds would be on them like flys on horse doo doo as I believe that would be similar to racketeering.
Rogie I think you are extremely naive here. The only person who takes issue with the skinmming comment seems to be you. You keep telling me how these guys make such a large investment blah blah blah but you know as well as I do that there is a contract in place. Murad is technically an employee of manny here. That is what you do not understand. You seem to think manny works for him. There is an obligation of disclosure here. Murad lied about the money he skimmed. He is basically saying that he got manny a big payday so he deserves more so he steals it and lies about where it went. He then trashes a guy like freddie roach who manny went to for help. He is stil tracshing freddie and that hurts Manny's career. His job is looking out for manny. When did this happen? To me, he has yet to look out for manny. He steals his money and possibly costs him the best trainer in boxing and also publicly insults manny and his drawing power. He sure seems to have manny's best interest at heart.
HBO does not need to be the promoter. All they should require is an open disclosure as to what the particiupants are being paid. They are putting out the money. It is very simple and would require about 3 sheets of paper. They actually tried to sign Manny without Murad shortly thereafter the MAB fight because Murad robbed him so much. I have said in the past that HBO is too close to being a promnoter. See Tyson Lewis for that. They pay as many promoters to move out of there way as they do for handling events.
You seem to have no feelings for the fighters. They deserve the lions share of the money. That is a fact. I understand initial investments and with full disclosure it would be just fine. These guys should be forced to do right by there clients. You cannot just say I want more now. There should be an agreed upon contract to start with and this would be mute.
IWAN, I think your emotion has got the better part of your judgement in regards to issue. I dont see the promoter-boxer relationship as being one in which the promoter "works" for the boxer. Theoretically that may be the case, but in practice it is totally different.
I see it as more of a business partnership. Pacquiao is basically an independent contractor who signed a business agreement with Murad Muhammed to promote his boxing matches. In exchange for his promotional rights, Muhammed has to deliver X amount of fights in X amount of years for a minimum X amount of dollars or Manny has legal grounds to get out of the deal. Of course, Pacquiao also got a signing bonus most likely. Also Murad has legal grounds for suing if Manny does not fulfill his obligations due to circumstances in his control. Manny's manager should be the one looking out for him and trying to get him more money. That is what managers are for(or used to be)-to make sure your guy has a good trainer, is staying away from the bottle or riff raff, and making sure that the promoter is not screwing him over.
You say that there should be full disclosure, but I ask you why a private business agreement between two parties should be disclosed publically? I think there should be a requirement that the FIGHTER should know what his promoter is getting(kinda like a federal form to be filed with the state athletic commission when TV is involved), but I dont think that it is necessarily your, mine, or the networks business what the agreement is between fighter and promoter for a particular bout.
AS fare as your crack about my "feelings for the fighters", you are once again incorrect. There are two sides to every coin, and it is not easy being a promoter.
"(G. Leon) $200,000 is not outrageous for him to take. It's basically standard operating procedure for a boxing promoter."
That is what Greg Leon of Boxingtalk.net said about the incident. Steve Kim of Maxboxing.com also states the same thing in his article on the situation.
Now, if it is PROVEN that Murad did something shady with the other $500k then I would definitely have beef with the guy.
Rogie I will admit 2 things here to show that I am not blinded by madness. First, this is not the biggest criminal act pulled on a fighter by a longshot. I understand what Leon is saying but 30% of the TOTAL PURSE is out of bounds. Any sane business perrson would agree wit that. My qusetion is "what does their signed agreement say"? Noone seems to know and Murad sure has not provided a signed document saying he was entitled to that big of a cut. I personally feel like he would have if he had it. Second, and more importantly in Murad's favor, I think Murad probably got Manny much more money than he would have gotten wityhout him. It sounds to me as if Golden Boy is crooked here as well. HBO puts up 700,000 for the fight and Golden Boy makes an initial offer of 350,000. (this is according to murad but Golden Boy has not denied it so who knows). It sounds like ole Oscar was trying to cut Manny as well.
Anyway, my take on HBO and others watching the money is like a General Contractor. These guys verify it all and there is a bonding company in place to protect other companies. You act like this is real hard. It is not. HBO could say "here is the money and we need to know how the money is being dispersed. What is the promoter and manager's cut and upon approval we will cut checks." It is simple as hell. It is HBO's money. They can create whatever hoops they wish to. It sounds as if they take somewhat of a blind eye in these situations. I think in many cases, boxing is promoted on its corruptness much like John Gotti was celebrated as a criminal. It is part of the allure of boxing.
Murad told Manny according to Roach that he was paid 300K. The fight was for 700K. He ripped him off. 28% is way to high a pcting.
I don't see my other response posted so in short. According to Roach, Manny said he was told he was paid 300K.He cleared 80K. The fight was for 700K. Murad lied and ripped him off. 28% is to high a cut for a promoter.