http://youtu.be/5wVlZX6Bw9E
check out ed being awesome and using the old school one arm in pass. i guess that is still part of rorion's system?
can any gracie torrance practitioners tell me:
is the rationale that the pass is to be used against an untrained attacker so the triangle is not a concern OR that when done properly the triangle is defended?
thanks for your time
he uses it at 0:30
my instructor who is a black belt under royce and came up from torrance uses this pass constantly and i have never seen anyone triangle him ive tried and tried and tried and have never been successful, to the point i gave up because i know if i keep trying i just get passed.
there are details about that pass that come with lots of practice and not all of the details can be learned 1st time you learn the pass. its one of those techniques that you really have to refine and practice to get right.
i personally prefer other passing methods, but i know for a fact from experience that this pass works when done correctly.
up
demandango -
can any gracie torrance practitioners tell me:
is the rationale that the pass is to be used against an untrained attacker so the triangle is not a concern OR that when done properly the triangle is defended?
While I'm not a Gracie Academy student, I have been a fanboy since 1993. ;) And to that end, awhile back I posted a brief explanation of the mechanics behind the stack pass, aka the "Gracie Gift", based on my lifelong whitebelt understanding.
Take it for what it's worth:
The mechanics that make it work are good posture(head up before/after loading the leg), the angle/space created by posting on the bicep, and the leverage/position you have stacking the leg as you pass.
Posture = if the bottom man can't break you down he can't reach up/figure-four for the triangle or armbar.
Posting on the bicep = the arm is stretched out, but as you post and then turn to open the guard the posting arm/shoulder turns(ie: crook of the elbow faces downward) and it stays on the opposite/wrong side of the bottom man's body so a) there's too much space between your shoulder/neck to be choked because the figure-four, if he can even get it it locked is back too far(past/below their deltoid, with your calf/ankle almost touching their lats instead of the correct position...leg in front/on top of the deltoid, hamstring basically touching their tricep, thus giving you the leverage/tightness you need to make the choke work). The posting arm also keeps you in touch with the bottom man in terms of being able to dictate where/how he movies...ie: your posting arm on the bicep and hips/weight pushing forward means the bottom man can't switch his hips effectively to a) figure-four his legs and b) get extra leverage to finish the triangle.
Remember the triangle Anderson Silva had on Travis Lutter? He didn't finish it for a long time for exactly the same reason as above; too much space between Lutter's shoulder/neck because his arm/elbow was still on the wrong side.
The leverage/position of the leg loaded on the shoulder = you're using your whole body's power against his one leg, plus your stacking him in an uncomfortable position(ie: as in Moreira's pass, there's tremendous pressure on the ribs/chest making it hard to breath, much less move). But most of all, you're rotating away from the triangle at in such a way that the angle, speed, and leverage/pressure allows you to maintain posture and avoid/escape the triangle and armbar even if they see it coming(ie: they immediately try for the submission and/or put you in danger for a second).
*re: Moreira's pass see the clip below:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4iMRlwvRxQ
^He initiates the pass starting ~3:00 and by all accounts ends up breaking the guy's ribs.
i injured my foot so I started doing this pass,
what i've learned is to control the hip and keep your posture
common sense stuff really
Draculino does this pass a few times in his new rolling vids with the other two black belts. he goes to it repeatedly.
omoplautistic - Draculino does this pass a few times in his new rolling vids with the other two black belts. he goes to it repeatedly.
i believe drac does double under
Oh sorry, i meant the one arm reach back gracie "gift".
the pass that follows differs, yes.
Carlson Junior teaches this pass,too. There's nothing wrong with it as long as you do it correctly.
Baroquen Record - my instructor who is a black belt under royce and came up from torrance uses this pass constantly and i have never seen anyone triangle him ive tried and tried and tried and have never been successful, to the point i gave up because i know if i keep trying i just get passed.
there are details about that pass that come with lots of practice and not all of the details can be learned 1st time you learn the pass. its one of those techniques that you really have to refine and practice to get right.
i personally prefer other passing methods, but i know for a fact from experience that this pass works when done correctly.
+1. I have seen it used very effectively. Just need to get the details correct.