Submissions vs. Striking Argument.

mayiwhoop: Cool, agreed.

And you would never ever find me subbing someone on the street either. Unless they literally fell into one - positioing is the greatest thing to come out of MMA be it wrestling, striking or submissions.

As far as everyone being cross-trained yadda yadda. I think that's bullshit, 99% of people will come from one MA or the other, they will more often than not have a base which they will attempt to enforce on their opponent. Even the modern fighters who are apparently "cross-trained" have strong bases such as Fedor, Penn, Couture, Silva etc.

What's Fedor base that is so apparent?

He fights very differently each time depending on his opponent.

good analysis mayiwhoopu

Anybody that strikes in MMA or the street is an idiot. End of story. Submissions rule bitchs!

Elgringo, like I said I was responding to a thread named 'striking techniques don't work'.

I just thought it was ridiculous to say something like that and was proving why.

Like Pulsar rightly said, positioning is very important in MMA.

If you broke it down to standing strikes and ground strikes then it would probably even out more.

Maybe by then it would be @ 33% submissions, 33% standing strikes, and 33% ground strikes.

Striking is still effective and practical no matter where it takes place, and that's my point.... :-)

Pointless argument really...

The UFC rules do not favor strikers in my opinion. I've seen too many fights that could have been ended with a stomp to a downed man, knees to the head on the ground, etc...

But it really doesn't matter. Some grapplers have knocked people out cold and some strikers have submitted people. You go for what's there.

You need to learn both to be well-rounded.

Thanks Lobo!

I think that Fedor's base is mainly Sambo.

He has great throws and takedowns and great groundwork to go with his submissions.

Fedor pretty much has the complete package IMHO.

His stand up is great.... he has sneaky fast hands and an unorthodox style that throws people off. He has good kicks, but doesn't use them much.

His takedowns and throws are spectacular, only the BEST wrestlers can stop his throws and takedowns.

His positioning isn't bad... he is good at getting the top position, but he really doesn't try to pass the guard much. He just pounds away inside the guard.

His submissions are the SHIT... he has the ability to submit you from any position as he proved against Coleman. He also uses standing submissions (Fujita), which BJJers don't use much. BJJers always look for position first submission second, whereas vs. Fujita Fedor went for the choke standing THEN went for position.

Quite frankly, I think Fedor has it all EXCEPT a good chin. Fujita rocked his World with a punch and Fujita isn't known as a striker.

Might Crocop be able to exploit this weakness??? :-)

"i'm not sure what your point is. i don't think anyone is suggesting that striking isn't an effective or valid means to finish an opponent."

Like I clearly stated, there is a thread currently out called 'striking techniques don't work'.

Plus anytime people talk about the Ricco/Mino fight they will say that Mino won because striking isn't 'an attempt to end the fight'....

There are MANY people out there who claim that striking isn't effective or a way to finish a fight.

The fact that you're not sure what the point is explains why you agree with your life partner Goku!!

LMAO!!!

"The UFC rules do not favor strikers in my opinion. I've seen too many fights that could have been ended with a stomp to a downed man, knees to the head on the ground, etc..."

Ok, regardless of the debate on this thread - how can you honestly say that? Those techniques are most likely going to be more effective for the grappler FOR A START.

Rounds, no headbutts, no knees, no shoes - are all WAY more positive on a strikers game than a grappler's. Arguing that will make me laugh, so please someone go ahead and explain why they limit strikers?

"There are MANY people out there who claim that striking isn't effective or a way to finish a fight."

Seriously, no there isn't - go ahead and start naming people (except YF).

And let's not get started with the sort of 'talent' Dana has been introducing to UFC recently.

I thought Fedor's background was in Combat Sambo, which is a little different than sport Sambo.

"kind of like vintage cars that are considered bad ass but get shitty mileage"

Sorry YF, untappable nailed it, imo.

Actually, Royler in mastering jujutsu says the same thing - in a nicer way.

Your Father, this isn't a debate about the effectiveness of striking vs. grappling.

I never claimed that, I clearly stated that striking HAS EFFECTIVENESS IN MMA.

And just because there is grappling in a fight doesn't mean that BJJ is being used.

Mark Coleman used to get alot of people in the mount and he never took a lesson of BJJ in his life.

When I was 6 years old I used to get kids in the full mount, it doesn't mean I was studying BJJ.

Just because there is an exchange of ground positions doesn't mean that BJJ is being utilized.

It's almost time for 'the Ultimate Fighter' baby!!

THANK YOU GOD FOR ANSWERING MY PRAYERS!!! :-)

BTW, I still haven't heard about any streetfights that ended by submissions.....

mayi: I've seen a brawl with two guys being choked out one after another by rear nakeds, I assisted which was cool. I've seen guillotines finish two fights. Never seen an armbar but hey, I don't support the use of them in on the street anyway.

Subs are for show, positions and laying the fuckin smack down is where it's at for BJJ in streetfights (or any grappling for that matter).

"Quite frankly, I think Fedor has it all EXCEPT a good chin. Fujita rocked his World with a punch and Fujita isn't known as a striker."

Fujita isn't a striker, but he apparently can throw some serious bombs. Look at what he did to Ibrahim....ZZZZZZzzzzz

I heard a bunch of stories from Chris Brennan and Mark Laimon about when they used to look for streetfights.

They submitted quite a few people in streetfights from what they were saying.

I think Chris even used to be a bouncer if I'm not mistaken. That will get you in some fights.... :-)

BTW, TTT 4 Kenny Florian!!

WHAT A FIGHT!!! :-)