onepunchcombo - I have a question. It's not a knock against grappling arts, but curiosity. Yesterday, we finished class early and decided to do some light sparring on the ground. I was able to take my opponent's back and attempted a very sloppy RNC (never actually learned the technique...just too much UFC). While I was fighting to get it under the guy's chin, the instructor ran over and started stomping my head (simulated).
All the street fights I've seen (YouTube and real life) rarely involve one person. The instructor wanted to simulate this. Got the message. In this case...I kinda strayed from KM principles and went for a submission instead of an escape. Would have payed dearly in real life.
How would a BJJ practitioner, wrestler, etc handle this? Is this kind of situation addressed in BJJ? I've been seriously considering BJJ to improve my ground skills (or lack there of)..
so, your 'instructor' had you live rolling when you didn't even know what a RNC was? He then mock-stomped on your head to prove a point?
LOL, find a new school buddy. You're getting taken for a ride.
To answer your question: Sure, multiple attacker situations happen. Do you want to roll on the ground when fighting multiple people at once? No. Will you have a choice? Probably fucking not.
The fight is going to go where the numbers take it. Learn BJJ, because at LEAST you will be able to get back to your feet after being taken down.
We were mostly practicing escapes. I don't train in BJJ and never learned how to properly apply an RNC. There are some guys in class that have more ground skills than others. It actually was actually a good test because I had to improvise based on the type of situation I was in. I had an opportunity to strike vulnerable areas and get out...I chose the worst option that left me open for another attacker.
So your instructor had you 'practicing escapes' without showing you how to escape. Brilliant!
That was not a good test, it was a total waste of time and pretty embarrassing as far as teaching goes.
Again, you should leave your 'school'. The best you've learned is to 'attack vulnerable areas'...which translates to "I learned how to kick someone in the dick!"
Your school is a perfect demonstration of how crappy Krav is.
onepunchcombo - I have a question. It's not a knock against grappling arts, but curiosity. Yesterday, we finished class early and decided to do some light sparring on the ground. I was able to take my opponent's back and attempted a very sloppy RNC (never actually learned the technique...just too much UFC). While I was fighting to get it under the guy's chin, the instructor ran over and started stomping my head (simulated).
All the street fights I've seen (YouTube and real life) rarely involve one person. The instructor wanted to simulate this. Got the message. In this case...I kinda strayed from KM principles and went for a submission instead of an escape. Would have payed dearly in real life.
How would a BJJ practitioner, wrestler, etc handle this? Is this kind of situation addressed in BJJ? I've been seriously considering BJJ to improve my ground skills (or lack there of)..
so, your 'instructor' had you live rolling when you didn't even know what a RNC was? He then mock-stomped on your head to prove a point?
LOL, find a new school buddy. You're getting taken for a ride.
To answer your question: Sure, multiple attacker situations happen. Do you want to roll on the ground when fighting multiple people at once? No. Will you have a choice? Probably fucking not.
The fight is going to go where the numbers take it. Learn BJJ, because at LEAST you will be able to get back to your feet after being taken down.
This is the EXACT correct answer!
Hate to burst your bubble but you learn how to avoid and recover from takedowns as well in krav maga. Everything is subjective to who your trainer is.
No you dont. What you meant to say is "Krav attempts, poorly, to mimic real martial arts except without all that pesky pressure testing"
onepunchcombo - I have a question. It's not a knock against grappling arts, but curiosity. Yesterday, we finished class early and decided to do some light sparring on the ground. I was able to take my opponent's back and attempted a very sloppy RNC (never actually learned the technique...just too much UFC). While I was fighting to get it under the guy's chin, the instructor ran over and started stomping my head (simulated).
All the street fights I've seen (YouTube and real life) rarely involve one person. The instructor wanted to simulate this. Got the message. In this case...I kinda strayed from KM principles and went for a submission instead of an escape. Would have payed dearly in real life.
How would a BJJ practitioner, wrestler, etc handle this? Is this kind of situation addressed in BJJ? I've been seriously considering BJJ to improve my ground skills (or lack there of)..
so, your 'instructor' had you live rolling when you didn't even know what a RNC was? He then mock-stomped on your head to prove a point?
LOL, find a new school buddy. You're getting taken for a ride.
To answer your question: Sure, multiple attacker situations happen. Do you want to roll on the ground when fighting multiple people at once? No. Will you have a choice? Probably fucking not.
The fight is going to go where the numbers take it. Learn BJJ, because at LEAST you will be able to get back to your feet after being taken down.
This is the EXACT correct answer!
It's the right answer ("Will you have a choice? Probably fucking not.")
for a retard moran, ignorant as fuck loser boy putz, which the poster is without exception.
Now that's real bad ass but to say that 1 on 2 or 1 on three attacks are very rarely fought off by skilled martial artists is delusional. Frankly it's sometimes not even a big deal to boot (unlike the video). Sometimes multiple attackers depend on the fact that you'll just give up and not want to engage (like in a mugging I mean).
So yea being proficient on your feet is a great way to start in the MA's.
Between this thread, and the one on Bruce Lee, it is very apparent you are a super gullible person who thinks martial arts myths are real. Good luck with that.
You also seem to lack reading comprehension skills. It was me who stated fighting multiple attackers is a losing proposition, you twit.
Wait, never mind, it is me who misunderstood. You are actually stupid enough, and so enamored by mythology, that you believe a 3 on 1 scenario is winable in anything other than a statistical anomaly (google it)
Yes, you are even more gullible than I first assumed.
If you are over the age of 16 I feel terribly sorry for you.
onepunchcombo - I have a question. It's not a knock against grappling arts, but curiosity. Yesterday, we finished class early and decided to do some light sparring on the ground. I was able to take my opponent's back and attempted a very sloppy RNC (never actually learned the technique...just too much UFC). While I was fighting to get it under the guy's chin, the instructor ran over and started stomping my head (simulated).
All the street fights I've seen (YouTube and real life) rarely involve one person. The instructor wanted to simulate this. Got the message. In this case...I kinda strayed from KM principles and went for a submission instead of an escape. Would have payed dearly in real life.
How would a BJJ practitioner, wrestler, etc handle this? Is this kind of situation addressed in BJJ? I've been seriously considering BJJ to improve my ground skills (or lack there of)..
so, your 'instructor' had you live rolling when you didn't even know what a RNC was? He then mock-stomped on your head to prove a point?
LOL, find a new school buddy. You're getting taken for a ride.
To answer your question: Sure, multiple attacker situations happen. Do you want to roll on the ground when fighting multiple people at once? No. Will you have a choice? Probably fucking not.
The fight is going to go where the numbers take it. Learn BJJ, because at LEAST you will be able to get back to your feet after being taken down.
This is the EXACT correct answer!
It's the right answer ("Will you have a choice? Probably fucking not.")
for a retard moran, ignorant as fuck loser boy putz, which the poster is without exception.
Now that's real bad ass but to say that 1 on 2 or 1 on three attacks are very rarely fought off by skilled martial artists is delusional. Frankly it's sometimes not even a big deal to boot (unlike the video). Sometimes multiple attackers depend on the fact that you'll just give up and not want to engage (like in a mugging I mean).
So yea being proficient on your feet is a great way to start in the MA's.
Between this thread, and the one on Bruce Lee, it is very apparent you are a super gullible person who thinks martial arts myths are real. Good luck with that.
You also seem to lack reading comprehension skills. It was me who stated fighting multiple attackers is a losing proposition, you twit.
It's losing if you lay on your back & fight BJJ moran. That what I said
It did no lose for him or hundreds of other times in real life when guys fought with MA's on there feet. Or a complete moran would not get it. I amazed that you know what comprehension even means.
Yea in the other thread you bashed Bruce a MA's legend again as ever saying he was a joke & I defended him with a half dozen fighters who said he was a top MA. Glad you brought that up.
Seeing that I've done both combat systems KM AND systems in addition to the formal arts of karate, judo, and a bit of god I think I can offer a bit of reality regarding combat systems. First off, they are not fake. Period. The problem lies in the way it's demonstrated. Seeing that one cannot realistically spar a system that is based of the premise of killing an opponent the two major combat systems have to demonstrate in a mannot that reminiscent of the stupid Thai chi exhibitions. If you are wondering if these combat systems would be effective against a well trained mixed martial artist the answer is no. These syetms are designed soley for real world applications where the oppents are both unaware of your ability and they themselves are only mildly talanted fighters. The systems of systema and km are best utilized when the opponent(s) are surprised by ones quick offensesive moves stemming from a very natural stance. Catching an opponent off guard is what combat systems are all about. To compare combat systems to martial arts is like apples to oranges. In different scenarios each style may be more or less effective. And if it makes you feel better two similarly trained men of same size , one traned (: in mma, the other in km or systema, the marital artist would likely win. However, that's based on the assumption the martial artist is aware of his oppent's skillset in hand to hand combat. Hope this insight helps with any confusion. Cheers-
igotfrozordfortrainingtrane - Seeing that I've done both combat systems KM AND systems in addition to the formal arts of karate, judo, and a bit of god I think I can offer a bit of reality regarding combat systems. First off, they are not fake. Period. The problem lies in the way it's demonstrated. Seeing that one cannot realistically spar a system that is based of the premise of killing an opponent the two major combat systems have to demonstrate in a mannot that reminiscent of the stupid Thai chi exhibitions. If you are wondering if these combat systems would be effective against a well trained mixed martial artist the answer is no. These syetms are designed soley for real world applications where the oppents are both unaware of your ability and they themselves are only mildly talanted fighters. The systems of systema and km are best utilized when the opponent(s) are surprised by ones quick offensesive moves stemming from a very natural stance. Catching an opponent off guard is what combat systems are all about. To compare combat systems to martial arts is like apples to oranges. In different scenarios each style may be more or less effective. And if it makes you feel better two similarly trained men of same size , one traned (: in mma, the other in km or systema, the marital artist would likely win. However, that's based on the assumption the martial artist is aware of his oppent's skillset in hand to hand combat. Hope this insight helps with any confusion. Cheers-
Sorry never traned god, even though that would be an epic style. however, tkd yes.*
onepunchcombo - I have a question. It's not a knock against grappling arts, but curiosity. Yesterday, we finished class early and decided to do some light sparring on the ground. I was able to take my opponent's back and attempted a very sloppy RNC (never actually learned the technique...just too much UFC). While I was fighting to get it under the guy's chin, the instructor ran over and started stomping my head (simulated).
All the street fights I've seen (YouTube and real life) rarely involve one person. The instructor wanted to simulate this. Got the message. In this case...I kinda strayed from KM principles and went for a submission instead of an escape. Would have payed dearly in real life.
How would a BJJ practitioner, wrestler, etc handle this? Is this kind of situation addressed in BJJ? I've been seriously considering BJJ to improve my ground skills (or lack there of)..
so, your 'instructor' had you live rolling when you didn't even know what a RNC was? He then mock-stomped on your head to prove a point?
LOL, find a new school buddy. You're getting taken for a ride.
To answer your question: Sure, multiple attacker situations happen. Do you want to roll on the ground when fighting multiple people at once? No. Will you have a choice? Probably fucking not.
The fight is going to go where the numbers take it. Learn BJJ, because at LEAST you will be able to get back to your feet after being taken down.
This is the EXACT correct answer!
It's the right answer ("Will you have a choice? Probably fucking not.")
for a retard moran, ignorant as fuck loser boy putz, which the poster is without exception.
Now that's real bad ass but to say that 1 on 2 or 1 on three attacks are very rarely fought off by skilled martial artists is delusional. Frankly it's sometimes not even a big deal to boot (unlike the video). Sometimes multiple attackers depend on the fact that you'll just give up and not want to engage (like in a mugging I mean).
So yea being proficient on your feet is a great way to start in the MA's.
Between this thread, and the one on Bruce Lee, it is very apparent you are a super gullible person who thinks martial arts myths are real. Good luck with that.
You also seem to lack reading comprehension skills. It was me who stated fighting multiple attackers is a losing proposition, you twit.
It's losing if you lay on your back & fight BJJ moran. That what I said
It did no lose for him or hundreds of other times in real life when guys fought with MA's on there feet. Or a complete moran would not get it. I amazed that you know what comprehension even means.
Yea in the other thread you bashed Bruce a MA's legend again as ever saying he was a joke & I defended him with a half dozen fighters who said he was a top MA. Glad you brought that up.
You said this: "but to say that 1 on 2 or 1 on three attacks are very rarely fought off by skilled martial artists is delusional. Frankly it's sometimes not even a big deal to boot"
If you actually believe this, you are as dumb as I claim you to be.
I know logic isn't your thing, but just because a professional fighter (who has never met, trained with, or fought Bruce) thinks he's tough...doesn't make it so. Chuck Liddells assessment of Bruces ability, based on enter the dragon.... is no more accurate that Joe the Plumber's.
I've fought an amateur MMA bout (Frankly, it barely even qualified). I used to be a big Bruce Lee fan. After researching him, I noticed a lot of bullshit. The fact that I've fought before, has zero bearing on facts and evidence.
This post was brought to you by a college education. Try it out sometime.
onepunchcombo - I have a question. It's not a knock against grappling arts, but curiosity. Yesterday, we finished class early and decided to do some light sparring on the ground. I was able to take my opponent's back and attempted a very sloppy RNC (never actually learned the technique...just too much UFC). While I was fighting to get it under the guy's chin, the instructor ran over and started stomping my head (simulated).
All the street fights I've seen (YouTube and real life) rarely involve one person. The instructor wanted to simulate this. Got the message. In this case...I kinda strayed from KM principles and went for a submission instead of an escape. Would have payed dearly in real life.
How would a BJJ practitioner, wrestler, etc handle this? Is this kind of situation addressed in BJJ? I've been seriously considering BJJ to improve my ground skills (or lack there of)..
so, your 'instructor' had you live rolling when you didn't even know what a RNC was? He then mock-stomped on your head to prove a point?
LOL, find a new school buddy. You're getting taken for a ride.
To answer your question: Sure, multiple attacker situations happen. Do you want to roll on the ground when fighting multiple people at once? No. Will you have a choice? Probably fucking not.
The fight is going to go where the numbers take it. Learn BJJ, because at LEAST you will be able to get back to your feet after being taken down.
This is the EXACT correct answer!
It's the right answer ("Will you have a choice? Probably fucking not.")
for a retard moran, ignorant as fuck loser boy putz, which the poster is without exception.
Now that's real bad ass but to say that 1 on 2 or 1 on three attacks are very rarely fought off by skilled martial artists is delusional. Frankly it's sometimes not even a big deal to boot (unlike the video). Sometimes multiple attackers depend on the fact that you'll just give up and not want to engage (like in a mugging I mean).
So yea being proficient on your feet is a great way to start in the MA's.
Between this thread, and the one on Bruce Lee, it is very apparent you are a super gullible person who thinks martial arts myths are real. Good luck with that.
You also seem to lack reading comprehension skills. It was me who stated fighting multiple attackers is a losing proposition, you twit.
It's losing if you lay on your back & fight BJJ moran. That what I said
It did no lose for him or hundreds of other times in real life when guys fought with MA's on there feet. Or a complete moran would not get it. I amazed that you know what comprehension even means.
Yea in the other thread you bashed Bruce a MA's legend again as ever saying he was a joke & I defended him with a half dozen fighters who said he was a top MA. Glad you brought that up.
You said this: "but to say that 1 on 2 or 1 on three attacks are very rarely fought off by skilled martial artists is delusional. Frankly it's sometimes not even a big deal to boot"
If you actually believe this, you are as dumb as I claim you to be.
I know logic isn't your thing, but just because a professional fighter (who has never met, trained with, or fought Bruce) thinks he's tough...doesn't make it so. Chuck Liddells assessment of Bruces ability, based on enter the dragon.... is no more accurate that Joe the Plumber's.
I've fought an amateur MMA bout (Frankly, it barely even qualified). I used to be a big Bruce Lee fan. After researching him, I noticed a lot of bullshit. The fact that I've fought before, has zero bearing on facts and evidence.
This post was brought to you by a college education. Try it out sometime.
You're a fool and moran and ignorant as fuck. I bet you don't have job. Chuck = Chuck Norris whom he trained with (Joe Lewis, and Mike Stone are two more) maybe? Who brought him up? I'm sure if Liddell did say something as AS and dozens of others have on bruce they are 10000X more qualified than you to say AND listen too!
I didnt have time to read all of this but yesterday I was teaching some very high level BJJ going from advanced DLR guard to helicopter sweeps and then we where also drilling deep half guard transitions in my advanced bjj class with all purple belts and higher. I started thinking about how I just told a wing chun guy that his art was bullshit and that it would not work in a fight. If that WC guy could have only seen me teach those deep half guard sweeps LOL he would have been like WTF do you think that would work in a fight :)
Someone made a ton of money off of Krav Maga and they have helped many traditional schools stay in business in this new era of MMA. Good for them!
From: Jeremy Horn 8 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile Posted: 12 hours ago Edited: 10/09/13 1:59 PM Member Since: 1/1/01 Posts: 170 Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Onepunchcombo,
I agree 100% that mindset is a very important thing to address. Weapons and multiple attackers are also issues that are worth going over.
My biggest problem with KM is that they (for the most part, from what I have seen) present the as SUPERIOR to MMA in the sense that it is designed for the street and that MMA is ONLY good for the sport aspect. In all the advertising I have seen it's always the same:
Krav Maga: when your life depends on it!! but also fitness, sport, etc...
So they tell you it's too deadly for the cage but then in the same breath tell you they have people who fight in MMA. You can't have it both ways. In fact, they can't have it EITHER way. What they teach is, GUARANTEED, to not work in the cage. They tell you that themselves. But I'm also telling you that it won't work on the street. Mindset aside.
It's like they want to ride the coat tails of MMA into popularity while bashing it and saying it's inferior.
I'm sure we have all seen this. It's a very common KM technique. Your opponent comes at you with a big overhand punch. You step in and with one hand block inside his arm, like a typical Karate block while the other hand drives up on his chin or nose. Then you pull him down into a barrage of knees and so on. Does anyone think that will really work? That is complete BS. That would be completely legal in MMA and yet it has never been seen. Why didn't Cain use it when JDS KOed him? Because there is NO WAY you could stop the momentum of that punch like that. It would crash right through your arm and your face. Not to mention that the attacker then stands completely still for the rest of the assault. There are a ton more just like it. It's just crap and I'm tired of seeing it.
I constantly see KM people saying that it is only for the street as if that excuses the sloppy punching, and bad form in everything.
KM may have a good handle on preparing the mind for combat but all the rest is junk. They might as well sit in a classroom and give lectures on mindset instead because all they are doing is giving you an unloaded gun and convincing you it's loaded. When you need to pull the trigger and it doesn't go off you are in big trouble. But if you don't have a gun you won't hang around to try it. You KNOW you are in trouble and you run instead of trying to stay and fight. And if you can't run then you had better know how to fight, for real.
As far as KM being trained thru drills and scenarios how far can you go when the opponent isn't allowed to fight back? It never ends there. When that guy throws that big overhand and you block it don't you think that his momentum alone would drive him into you and possibly a bear hug of some sort?
I'm all for people doing anything they want for fun and fitness but this has gone on long enough. I can't sit quietly anymore and watch people being lied to about what they are learning. I'm a small step away from going into some KM schools around here and setting them straight. The only reason I don't is because I don't want to hurt the feelings of the instructors in there because most of them have been lied to themselves and are just passing it along.
If you are that paranoid, as I am, then do like I do. I carry a gun and a knife everywhere I go. I always sit with my back against a wall. When I enter a room I look around for trouble. I count how many people in the room. I size up everyone and everything around me, always. I also train in the most effective, proven techniques I can. I also train, and compete in IDPA matches. Mostly for fun but there is also a level of mindset and preparation there as well.
I can't agree with you that krav maga is not effective for self-defense. for sure it has similarities with other martial arts, but all of them are MARTIAL arts after all. Read this http://www.thebaynet.com/community/family/martial-arts-for-self-defence-where-to-start.html
When someone only makes 0.68 posts per year on a 18 year old account. You listen to them.
Didn't really read btw.
And when someone signs up for the site 18+ years later to bump a 5 year old thread to argue, you take note as well, particularly in defense of the effectiveness of a TMA.
