Baku i just watched that, interesting, looks like chinese MMA really is improving. I could actually see some chinese "flavoured" striking in there as well and the throws were quite unique as well.
Ironmonkey i think you made an honest appraisal before of the sanda scene as far as i've seen it. Man those guys have quick side kicks though jeeez
Good thread, except for the usual suspects, nice links, but I have to ask:
Lemon, do you have any idea how many styles of CMA there are?
1000's
but how many are effective? and how many confident enough for mma
Watched some fights from an MMA event in China. Looks like a smaller version of Pride Bushido or Shooto. The fights I've seen so far have been pretty exciting.
Baku watched it, they werent bad, the standup neways, still bit sloppy but moments of brilliance.
"Who says they revere kung-fu? You think the billion plus chinamen on this planet all wake up simulataneoulsy and do the preying mantis in the morning?
The average Chinese thinks about kung-fu as much as the average person here thinks about MMA: they dont think about it all that much at all."
I think the average man in China wakes up and tries to figure out a way to get something to eat that day.
^^^^
And keep the government out of his hair.
I'm glad to see mma being practiced in China. I think it'd be much further along in both China and Taiwan if Lei-Tai competitions hadn't been outlawed. That one move essentially undid the testing process for CMA. Because traditionally, without ranks, it really did boil down to how well you could fight.
"I am just suprised there was nothing resembling barefisted kung fu that has been practiced for centuries."
I used to do tai chi with a man who trained in nothing but internal martial arts with an instructor who came over from China. When he fought, he stood in a boxing type stance and although his punching didn't look exactly like boxing it was similar. He usually used striking to get in close so he could throw his opponent. When he grappled it looked like wrestling.
I asked him why he doesn't stand in any specific kung fu stance when fighting. He said when you fight you always protect your head, which is why he had his hands up like a boxer. He continued to tell me that any CMA guy who fights using kung fu stances probably has never really trained to fight.
LOL baku, makes sense.
If your stance changes, the look of your strikes may also differ from how they look when training.
I knew a blackbelt in shito-ryu karate and he was telling me when you start a punch from the waist, it is to train to try to get your fist to travel a long distance as fast as possible. If you can be fast throwing a punch from your waist to your opponent's face, then if your hands are closer to the target (like up near your own face) your punch will be even faster. Whether that's true or not, I don't care. But, it could explain why sometimes martial arts looks different from how we imagine it when practiced in actual fighting.
Baku, my father was a karate teacher and he'd say similar things. When i went to thailand i did not see a SINGLE leg kick thrown the whole time, thais only practice kicking the ribs and head. Same as knees.
However they are known as having devestating legkicks (take champuek Kiatsongrit, who was one of my coaches) but he NEVER taught a leg kick. (give him 100 Baht and he'll do it on the bag for u...insane power even when he is drunk) they never practice it, it just comes out in real fight.
BUT they fight for real every weekend since they are 6....so maybe my example is moot...actually likely it is.
I don't really think the example is moot. CMA used to have a lot of times when practitioners would fight. Inter-school challenges, lei-tai, etc. were all places where people would have to put their money where their mouth was. Somewhere along the lines much of that dropped out. It'd be as if the fights dropped out of Muay Thai. In a 100 years people would be wondering what the fuck the music and dancing's all about.
Regarding seeing kung-fu style stances. Aren't stances essentially transitional movements? I don't think they're ever really meant to be held for any period of time except while training. I think it's a way to teach someone how to maintain balance and stay strong througout a movement.
Karate and Kung fu schools nowadays woulda argue with u about the last point, but i think you're right about most of it, particularly people going WTF is with the music and dancing lol
"Karate and Kung fu schools nowadays woulda argue with u about the last point"
Depends who you talk to. Some people on empty flower seem to agree with this.
Jellyman, i'm not saying all just alot, that said, alot of people talk about stuff and then dont actually do it, TMA guys can be very guilty of this. For eg, all the tai chi talk of not actually practicing the groin kicks in their forms but they are there....WHEN do u actually do them?
Same goes for Bunkai in karate kata (application) when do you REALLY do it?
LEMon
This is true, a lot of people have only theoretical knowledge of the things they are supposed to know.