What I find funny is there are plenty of guys going from white to black in 5 years. Despite that fact you have guys saying you should be a black belt for 9 years before you can promote someone to black.
Brian McLaughlin -
What I find funny is there are plenty of guys going from white to black in 5 years. Despite that fact you have guys saying you should be a black belt for 9 years before you can promote someone to black.
I'm totally fine with elite full-time BJJers going from white to black in 5 years.
Being a 9 years black belt to promote someone is weird. A 2nd degree black belt is fine if you have guys giving ranks.
It's all about the pyramid of power.
Akston - One of the oldest and most experienced people has a system and young people question it for all the wrong reasonsExactly!!!! And this is why BJJ is becoming so watered down over the past decade. I've been a brown belt for 4 years. 1 stripe currently training 4-5x per week under Relson. Wouldn't change a damn thing about it. I KNOW... When I get my BB, it'll be well deserved. Plain and simple, no matter how long it takes.
Preserve traditions and respect the legends.
The Professional -Akston - One of the oldest and most experienced people has a system and young people question it for all the wrong reasonsExactly!!!! And this is why BJJ is becoming so watered down over the past decade. I've been a brown belt for 4 years. 1 stripe currently training 4-5x per week under Relson. Wouldn't change a damn thing about it. I KNOW... When I get my BB, it'll be well deserved. Plain and simple, no matter how long it takes.
Preserve traditions and respect the legends.
You training out in Hawaii?... If so tell Bobby Deloroy that the Meatgrinder says hi.
I'm a Caique black belt...ask any questions you want (my first AMA).
You don't have to get your white bar first. Myself and others have received our red bars for being instructors and knowing/teaching the self-defense curriculum. White bars are reserved for BB who may not teach regularly. They still know the same things, just aren't regular instructors.
His standards are "strict" in the sense that once you get your BB from him it's not a free for all allowing you to promote whoever and wherever you want. 99% of us under Caique appreciate that standard. The 1% who don't have left and shopped around to get their black belts from others.
I don't think that's strict at all. I think the IBJJF and most others require you to be a BB for 9 years (effectively, 3rd degree) to promote another black belt.
I disagree with those ranting about how the old school way is better, trash talking these "young guys questioning old school guys and their systems." I couldn't care less about what Relson or Caiquie would have to say about requirements for getting black belts. They spout on and on about how prestigious it is to have received a black belt from them but yet when you look at it, neither of them have produced any quality black belts on a world class level, whether it be BJJ/ADCC competition, vale tudo, or mma.
Sorry, this might sound like a rant but I have trained with/attended seminars with many red & black/red belts and it seems like every time I train with another one, the experience just seems the same. A guy who has trained for a long time, got complacent with their skills to not improve much anymore and just ride out their famous name/rank. I don't get disillusioned with the rank on a pedestal anymore after numerous bad experience.
On the contrary, training with young/competitive black belts have proved to be a huge refresher for my game
mideastgrappler - I don't think that's strict at all. I think the IBJJF and most others require you to be a BB for 9 years (effectively, 3rd degree) to promote another black belt.Awesome. Glad you found what you are looking for out of Jiu Jitsu.
I disagree with those ranting about how the old school way is better, trash talking these "young guys questioning old school guys and their systems." I couldn't care less about what Relson or Caiquie would have to say about requirements for getting black belts. They spout on and on about how prestigious it is to have received a black belt from them but yet when you look at it, neither of them have produced any quality black belts on a world class level, whether it be BJJ/ADCC competition, vale tudo, or mma.
Sorry, this might sound like a rant but I have trained with/attended seminars with many red & black/red belts and it seems like every time I train with another one, the experience just seems the same. A guy who has trained for a long time, got complacent with their skills to not improve much anymore and just ride out their famous name/rank. I don't get disillusioned with the rank on a pedestal anymore after numerous bad experience.
On the contrary, training with young/competitive black belts have proved to be a huge refresher for my game
<blockquote>The Professional - <span id='userPost53894545' class='User-264323'><blockquote>Akston - One of the oldest and most experienced people has a system and young people question it for all the wrong reasons <img src="/images/phone/apple.png" alt="Phone Post 3.0" border="0" style="vertical-align:middle;"/></blockquote>Exactly!!!! And this is why BJJ is becoming so watered down over the past decade. I've been a brown belt for 4 years. 1 stripe currently training 4-5x per week under Relson. Wouldn't change a damn thing about it. I KNOW... When I get my BB, it'll be well deserved. Plain and simple, no matter how long it takes. <br><br>Preserve traditions and respect the legends. <img src="/images/phone/apple.png" alt="Phone Post 3.0" border="0" style="vertical-align:middle;"/></span></blockquote><br /> Voted up. I feel the same way about it. I wish Caique's system was the gold standard throughout all of BJJ. You'd see a lot fewer of the three year "phenom" black belts out there that literally buy their belt and make their students call them master.
12 -He might be referring to a couple of guys here in central-southeast Texas.Randy Malacas -Rylan Lizares -
That is the common practice by Helio Gracie lineage. 3rd Degree BB to promote New BBs, 3 years to get each stripe on your black.
THIS
Seen a guy that promoted someone to black a few months after he got his black. POWHA
u talking about higgs and lister ?
Mrbrownfolks -When the second wave of Americans got their BBs, you saw quick turn-around promotions where they were immediately promoting people to black belts. Caique's (and other's) standards was a way to preserve the system that prevented this from happening.12 -He might be referring to a couple of guys here in central-southeast Texas.Randy Malacas -Rylan Lizares -
That is the common practice by Helio Gracie lineage. 3rd Degree BB to promote New BBs, 3 years to get each stripe on your black.
THIS
Seen a guy that promoted someone to black a few months after he got his black. POWHA
u talking about higgs and lister ?
I'm a 40 year old 2 year blue belt and I doubt I'll ever really make it to black belt and if I do awesome, if I don't, so what as long as I'm still doing Jiu Jitsu as often as my body allows. Unless you plan on opening your own school who cares how long it takes just stay training and if you get it good job.
Caique is simply holding me, and his other black belts, to the same standards he was held to (by Helio)... I'm fine with that standard.
Angelo Popofski - Caique is simply holding me, and his other black belts, to the same standards he was held to (by Helio)... I'm fine with that standard.
The same standard that got ryron and rener promoted far higher than Galvao?
no thanks.
ckaa -Caique didn't promote them.Angelo Popofski - Caique is simply holding me, and his other black belts, to the same standards he was held to (by Helio)... I'm fine with that standard.
The same standard that got ryron and rener promoted far higher than Galvao?
no thanks.
Jeez. You guys are impossible. If Caique's own black belts don't have a problem with it, I don't see how anyone else would.
I am proud on my 6th degree BB is Shendokan. The Gand Master Shen mailed it to me himself, along with a certificate suitable for framing.
Never seen a thread about too stringent promotions before. Makes me proud of my Caique/Eldred lineage! And from the little I've seen or heard. If the academy's black belt isn't ready to promote others, Caique does it himself.
Sugarfoot - Never seen a thread about too stringent promotions before. Makes me proud of my Caique/Eldred lineage! And from the little I've seen or heard. If the academy's black belt isn't ready to promote others, Caique does it himself.Lol it's not about too stringent promotions, it's about someone controlling his black belts to the point of it coming across as a bit odd. Not that that's necessarily a bad thing in practice but it's much different than what you interpreted.
Again, it's not necessarily a bad thing, it just certainly seems beyond the norm and beyond what other old school guys including Helio followed.
JoejitsuMD - Again, it's not necessarily a bad thing, it just certainly seems beyond the norm and beyond what other old school guys including Helio followed.It's not necessarily a "crazy" thing either. I think it helps keep Caique BJJ, his name, from being watered down. People can go elsewhere and get promoted to black belt. People also respect history, lineage and loyalty. Not saying you don't, but it's not crazy, and there is precedent. Is it crazy to openly call him crazy for doing what he was taught by Helio? Idk man, maybe ask him and see how that goes. If the question was posed in a respectful manner, you might get his reasoning instead of ours.