Recently Kid Peligro, one of the most respected authors and figures in the BJJ community, visited the Gracie Academy and had a chance to witness a Gracie Combatives class. He had some very interesting thoughts about what he saw.
“Recently I've been thinking a lot and having a tough time with the current state of BJJ. This problem for me started after the 2009 World Championships, at that time many of the finals lacked the excitement and the drama that normally finals would carry. I thought it was just an anomaly but the same or worse occurred in 2010, when some competitors, using modern techniques, ended up entangled for most of the matches without any action. These matches even drew comments from the normally quiet Japanese reporters as to "how boring the matches were." Of course this was not the case in every weight division and with every fighter; Roger Gracie and some other "Tops" were going for it in all their matches. But a fair number of finals, as I said were super boring.
Since then I've been thinking quite a bit about what is the reason why anyone would want to learn BJJ? If, as a new student, you had just watched what I'd watched at the Worlds, BJJ for you would be a set of sportive techniques that would not help you in a real life situation. And look, I am not against sport BJJ, but by the looks of things, we are getting more and more removed from the real reason the "arte suave" became so popular: Because it is one of the most effective ways for a regular person to defend him or herself against a stronger opponent!
And that brings me to my point; recently I visited the Gracie Academy in Torrance, California. In talking with Rener Gracie, grandson of the legend Grandmaster Helio Gracie, the subject of the focus of JJ came up and I brought up the experience of the Worlds. That is when Rener showed me their program called "Gracie Combatives." Gracie Combatives is a modernization of the core self-defense program taught at the original Gracie Academy in Rio. The idea of Gracie Combatives is to teach a "normal" person how to defend and survive a "real life" attack. Something that many of us fear, and the reason most people join a Martial Arts academy. In the Gracie Combatives course they address how to survive and defend the most common street aggression situations such as strikes, grabs and head-locks, both standing up and on the ground. The program not only shows you how to defend and counter these situations but also has many live drills, what they call “Reflex Development Drills” and “Fight Simulation Drills,” in which you are forced to practice the defenses and counters in succession and in conjunction with a series of developing attacks. Most of the situational drills evolve until you end up submitting your opponent.
After watching the Gracie Combatives group class, (Note: the entire program is also available on DVD) and hearing what Rener and Rorion had to say, it just solidified my belief that, although BJJ has a fun competition side to it, the most important aspect is being totally neglected at most schools. The greatest benefit for us "normal" people to learn BJJ is the increased confidence we gain from knowing we can defend ourselves in a real fight, and with Gracie Combatives that is exactly what we get. Once you've mastered the self-defense aspect of the art, and you are 100% confident you can defend against a bigger stronger adversary, then you should feel free to expand your knowledge of BJJ as you wish.
That is when the words of my master, Royler Gracie, rung even more true. Royler always emphasized self-defense, and he used to say: "If you don't know how to escape from a head-lock, you are in trouble. What will you do if someone gets you in a head-lock on the streets? Yell out, 'hey I'm a Royler Gracie purple belt?' that’s not going to solve your problem!"
So don't take it from me but hear what the masters are saying and, more importantly, doing. Learn the self-defense aspect. Someday it may save you from a bad situation and you will thank me for it.
Now go train Jiu-Jitsu!”
-Kid Peligro
kidpeligro@gmail.com
www.kidpeligro.com
twitter.com/kidpeligro
Looks like Kid Peligro and the Gracies have finally buried the hatchet.
Kid's right. Your JJ is only as good as your ability to escape a common head lock, safely enter a clinch or even perform a takedown or two. Gracie Barra seems to have a nice combination of teaching some self-defense positions, followed by the sportive aspects in their fundamentals program. This may be the secret to their mass appeal; a curriculum that emphasizes the defense aspects first, but doesnt ignore the ground sparring either (as far as I know white belts roll at the GB schools - ?).
You know 12, years ago, wasn't this the criticism of the school by outsiders saying that the (Torrance) "Gracies weren't showing everything". Was it the sportive aspect that people weere talking about and felt slighted? Has anything ever really changed over there over the years, or have they just been religiously touting the same principles of self-defense first, while the other schools were 99% sport, and therefore perceived as "showing more" than the Gracies? If nothing has changed in their teaching emphasis, then they have been true to their students all along, and it was everybody else that didnt get where they were coming from, and assumed that they were hiding the sportive ground techniques from their students. I would be interested to hear from a Gracie/Torrance historian.
Combatives is a great program but putting a blue belt on those guys is wrong
Judo Scott - Combatives is a great program but putting a blue belt on those guys is wrong
Do you mean giving a blue to the people who've done the course via video, or the students who've done the Combatives program at the academy?
James
Either one..
We have a local school here that does the combatives program and they are a great school, their students are nice, the instructors there are really cool but when you roll with them they are not blue belts. The first time they roll with a real blue belt or even white belts with about 6 months of solid training they are usually shocked at how defenseless they are.
Judo Scott - Either one..
We have a local school here that does the combatives program and they are a great school, their students are nice, the instructors there are really cool but when you roll with them they are not blue belts. The first time they roll with a real blue belt or even white belts with about 6 months of solid training they are usually shocked at how defenseless they are.
I know this. That is my problem with the whole deal.
The Combative system is great. I have the DVDs, I like them and think they are very good. BUT it needs to be supported by live rolling.
One of the FUNDAMENTAL assertions of Brazilian Jiu jitsu is that you need to train with resistance. So the Combatives stuff --as a stand alone system- is a step BACKWARDS in evolution, focusing on "kata" and doing things "exactly like so", rather than focusing on the real deal which is what it is like to really pull this stuff off against a resisting opponent.
truehonor,from what i recall,i never remember them holding back.there r things they didnt teach,but always taught how to defend the move.
when we 1st joined the academy,i heard all the stories. so i took my kid to saulo and a few others for privates so i could understand what ppl were talking about.it didnt take more then 2 min to see what everyone was talking about,he did so many things different.from the stand up pass to the rnc escape.but everytime he showed a move it was based on getting points,leaving your face wide open to get hit.
i think the 1/2 guard is the worst position to be in for a fight ,but great for sport bjj.i remeber helio yelling at jordan when he was a kid going against a blue belt adult.we all looked around because no one understood what he was say'n.so we asked ryron ,the oldman was telling jordan whats taking u so long get back to guard he's to big.
judo scott,ryron ,rener,and rorion would agree with you.
what your sayn is what they tell all the blue belts.
on the other hand,they are not white belts.take 1 of your white belts and punch him and see how his 1/2 guard holds up.tell me how fast he rolls to his knees,gives up his back.you play like you practice
with that being said any bjj training is better then not training.
12, I agree rolling with punches is totally different and something everyone should do.
Oh Gracie Jiu-Jitsu self defense? Is that the one where you adopt an unagressive defensive strategy to save energy?
Those sport JJ guys are really boring though!
12, when there is sparring at the Gracie Academy is it always with strikes?
12 - judo scott,ryron ,rener,and rorion would agree with you.
what your sayn is what they tell all the blue belts.
on the other hand,they are not white belts.take 1 of your white belts and punch him and see how his 1/2 guard holds up.tell me how fast he rolls to his knees,gives up his back.you play like you practice
with that being said any bjj training is better then not training.
Actually, I think it would be a nice experiment to see how well a blue belt under Gracie Combatives does in a self defense situation vs. a blue belt in "sport" bjj school such as Alliance or any other reputable academy.
I would be willing to bet that the blue belt from the "sport" academy could do equally well in a self defense situation vs. one from Gracie Combatives.
While certain technical knowledge is involved, I still think it is time spent on the mat doing live rolling that determines how "good" someone is at self defense.
ostapbjj - 12, when there is sparring at the Gracie Academy is it always with strikes?
no ,only for the guys that want it.bjj as become for lack of a better word a fad,so all school need to or should focus on making some money.exceutive bjj is were its at, most older guys dont want to get hurt or sore from a class ,but want to be a part of it and get something out of it .the combatives offers that.
i told caique and javi the same thing, im an oldman i will never be great at bjj,but i love the game and ppl.dont make me pay so some young guy can whip on me.make your classes fun for me to be in.
"While certain technical knowledge is involved, I still think it is time spent on the mat doing live rolling that determines how "good" someone is at self defense."
u could be right,but spider guard not going to help you.
the spider guard in a bjj match ,the combatives guy wont stand a chance.
12, I beat combatives guys with simple closed guard techniques or simple guard passes to side control to mount.
They simply don't have any mat awareness. There's no need to do anything fancy (ie spider guard) to beat them.
12 -I disagree. I think, if you train how to defend strikes when in the position, half guard is fine. More than that, I find Half-Guard works well with people bigger than me. I rolled when I first started BJJ with a guy who was 375 and full guard was impossible on him.
i think the 1/2 guard is the worst position to be in for a fight ,
Team Quest disagrees with you Mick
Who has team quest beat from HG that is moderately accomplished in BJJ?
Wilson Reis and Lil Nog have shown how HG (specifically, deep half guard) can be used effectively in MMA.
LOL @ gracie combative guys or joe blow blue belt having a 1/2 guard that keeps them from getting their face smashed in.