Please advise re: competitive mindset

Wall of text:

I've been training for six years and routinely get beat in "competitive" matches (e.g., in in-house tourneys) by people who've been training for less than six months.

The weird thing is I get beat by people who I will dominate - without much effort at all - in "regular" rolling during class. And it doesn't feel like they are going much harder in comp-style rolls. I can hit all my moves in normal training and even clown around on some of these people, but in competitive situations, I just can't execute. So I am pretty sure it is a mental thing.

I'm normally a very flow with the go, easygoing kind of grappler. In even semi-competitive situations, however, I experience problems, such as:

inability to concentrate on my main gameplan (find myself doing random youtube moves during match, instead of my "go-tos")

passivity (for example from guard I will gripfight, but then I don't "pull the trigger" and go for my armdrag, I hesitate then just keep gripfighting back and forth).

Now I feel like I am losing some self-confidence because my BJJ feels like it doesn't "work" when it really "matters."


I'm planning on doing my first comp this year. I've never competed before because I've always been nervous/scared, but every cloud has a silver lining and I think losing in in-house situations to beginners while all of my teammates are watching has made me realize that I have already experienced pretty much the most humiliating losses I can, so there's NOTHING to lose by going out and competing against guys at my own experience level. Hey, if I lose at least it will be to someone at my experience level and not a retarded quadraplegic 107-year-old with end-stage parkinsons who has been training for two days. Also I think competing may help to fix some of these issues all by itself.

I would really love some advice from the forum about this stuff, especially if you have had a similar problem or had a training partner (or student) who has experienced these issues. Also any recommendations for books about sports psychology and mindset would be much appreciated.

TL;DR I get dominated in competitive situations by guys I dominate during regular rolling because my mindset isn't right. Any advice would be much appreciated.

Have a great new year!

You've been training for six years and you get best by guys thay have been training for six months? Did I read that correctly? Phone Post 3.0

A_Butler - You've been training for six years and you get best by guys thay have been training for six months? Did I read that correctly? Phone Post 3.0

Yup.

I mean, not in normal training. That's the funny thing is that a guy I can beat with one hand tied behind my back during normal training, can beat me in a competitive roll.

But only when I am trying to be competitive. If we're doing normal rolling and a six-month guy tries to become "competitive" I can deal with that handily, usually without even breathing too hard. But same situation, someone's keeping track of points, I totally lose it.

For example in the last match I had a very good sweeping position but I just kind of passively "waited" for a better and better moment to go for the sweep until I lost the tempo and rather than me sweeping, he started passing.

I think you pointed out your main problem, "losing in front of friends".  Your going into your matches with that foremost in your mind and setting up a negative situation for yourself; "dont lose, dont lose, dont lose".  If you think like that you will probably lose.  Instead try to think on a positive, think about your first move; (im going to get my grips and hit the arm drag".   Dont think "I have to win" which places a lot of mental pressure, think "I want to win" which its a pleasure to want to do something.  

  if your opponent is particularly good at something, a common mistake is to think dont get caught in his_____(whatever).  Example, he's good at throws from the over under, so you think "i gotta stay out of the over under", which sets you up for just defensive posture and eventually he's going to get what he wants, the over under.    A better way to look at it is; " he's good at throws from the over under so im going to concentrate on grip fighting for a russian and hitting my single leg from there."  You arrive at the same thing(staying out of the over under with him) but you do it on your terms, setting up your game.  

If competing is something you want to do, and i dont think everyone needs to, then compete a lot.   Competing is stressful for some people but by doing it a lot, you kind of innoculate yourself to the stress.  It just starts to become another day doing what you love to do.  

  1. If you've been practicing for 6 years and are facing people who have been training for 6 months that means youre both white belts which means you haven't trained very often in those six years. So train more often

    2. Try competing more often and maybe somewhere where no one knows you.

    3. I've done pretty shitty in competitions the last 3 or 4 years so don't fret man it happens just keep going.

ChipW, thanks for the response. I wasn't consciously thinking about not losing but maybe unconsciously the pressure made me more hesitant.

Don't laugh, but the last time I competed in a sport was when I was a teenager and competed in a local table tennis tournament. I was so scared of missing my shots that I played a totally defensive game missing TONS of opportunities to score and lost badly becuase I could never throw up any offense. I think the same thing happens to me in rolls that I perceive that I need to "win".

Too hesitant to go for moves, not using my "A" game. I feel like this discussion is already a bit helpful for me. Thank you so much.

BTW I am not trying to take anything away from the other guy. He's talented, he trains a LOT and works his ass off, played a great game, and felt nice and heavy with a lot of pressure. I just feel like with a 5-year difference in experience, I should be able to "beat" people like him, shouldn't I? I'm pretty fucking terrible at this art, but isn't there a limit to how terribad a person can be?

No not really if you're still a white belt after 6 years then you haven't been training regularly.

I'm a blue belt, Judo Scott.

Some other things. 
Before the match, do some deep breathing to relax yourself and clear your head.  Visualize yourself in various situations, sometimes dominating, sometimes down on points and having to claw your way back, always visualize winning in the end though.

During the match, try to stay focused on the match.  It’s easy to get distracted; He’s up on points, I’m up on points, what’s my buddy saying over there, etc.  Just stay in the moment, if he scores just continue grappling, don’t dwell on it. 

After the match, win or lose, have a positive attitude.  Analyze your loses and learn from them but don’t dwell on it.  It’s not life or death, it’s fun either way. 

I’m a big believer in sports psychology, probably because I had a lot of natural athletic talent as a kid but I often defeated myself mentally before my games.  As I got older I wanted to know why.    Severe sports performance anxiety, which it sounds like you have, can really hold people back but there’s a ton of information out there and no reason that today’s athletes should be held back by the mental game.  It’s easy to fix. 

Check out some of the info from Brian Cain, he’s  got some good stuff that I think will help you

when your winning rolling sessions is the jiu jitsu your using the type that produces points or do you go for subs more?

Maybe pressure yourself more rolling and try to score points.. like imagine your down 6 and you have a minute to make it up

"I'm pretty fucking terrible at this art, but isn't there a limit to how terribad a person can be?"

 

Im not trying to be an asshole but you should begin by changing your self image.   I know you probably make comments like that almost as a joke but even when your joking, if you say stuff like that, you will begin to believe it.  

You dont have to talk about how great you are, just dont say anything, or think anything, negative about your self.  

It depends on how you leverage your experience to confront the situation.

If you funnel the person in a situation that you have been often, you should be able to have the upper hand because you grasp the situation better.

If you funnel the person in some neutral position where your experience is not as vast, then it doesn't really matter if you're a black belt, you might get caught.

As for anxiety, it helps to keep a tempo that is for yourself instead of letting the pace of the match dictate the beat. You need to able to set the pace of the match in order to keep balance mentally.


ChipW - 


"I'm pretty fucking terrible at this art, but isn't there a limit to how terribad a person can be?"



 



Im not trying to be an asshole but you should begin by changing your self image.   I know you probably make comments like that almost as a joke but even when your joking, if you say stuff like that, you will begin to believe it.  



You dont have to talk about how great you are, just dont say anything, or think anything, negative about your self.  


I don't think you're being an asshole at all. I greatly appreciate your frank advice. I prefer when people don't mince their words.

Veek - It depends on how you leverage your experience to confront the situation.

If you funnel the person in a situation that you have been often, you should be able to have the upper hand because you grasp the situation better.

If you funnel the person in some neutral position where your experience is not as vast, then it doesn't really matter if you're a black belt, you might get caught.

As for anxiety, it helps to keep a tempo that is for yourself instead of letting the pace of the match dictate the beat. You need to able to set the pace of the match in order to keep balance mentally.



Exactly my problem! I shouldn't have to funnel the match to a situation where I grasp the situation better, because someone training for 5 or 6 years should have a better grasp on EVERY situation than someone who has been training for 5 or 6 months.

And even when able to get to a strong position...for example, sometimes everything is ready for a sweep attempt and I just don't go for it and let the opportunity pass by. I don't know why exactly.

Have you trained consistently? Have you taken a lot of "breaks"? Was this guy a wrestler before bjj? I think alot of guys who "flow roll" all the time get into bad habits, letting guys pass your guard, get mount, etc... in training to work on defense or whatever just makes you accept getting passed and it comes out during tougher or harder rolls

Some guys are just really good when its comp style, like someone said earlier, you roll for points or always looking for subs? When points are involved one mistake and it could be over

I think a big part of my problem very similar to the table tennis thing I wrote about earlier in the thread. I got my opponent to give me a perfect set-up for a powerful offensive shot, maybe even a slam - but then, terrified of missing, I just make a defensive return of the ball, allowing the other guy to go offensive again.

Ironically, if I were simply to say fuck it and go for, say, a sweep even if I'm scared of missing it, the worst thing that would happen is I get passed, which invariably happens anyway...when you're too nervous to just try it! lol

Sometimes you overestimate how much better you grasp a certain situation. It's not something theoretical because of a longer time on the mat. You need to be able to assign relevant experience to it. If i find myself in a situation that i recognize, i can recall 5 top of head without thinking of previous rolls where ive been in the same setting and their outcomes.

As to going for the move, again it's a matter of tempo. If you assign yourself a rhythm ( or a framed micro deadline at intervals) this should not be too much of a problem unless you completely misread the situation.

Just refuse to lose.

Be a predator. Intend to hunt, even if you end up being hunted yourself.

Another blue belt at our academy is one of my favorite guys to train with specifically because I know I CAN'T go easy. He's a touch bigger than me, very strong, has an endless gas tank, and rolls like it's a competition all the time, except he adds a willingness to experiment that I'm sure he wouldn't do in a tournament.

If I'm passive for even a moment, he'll sweep, sub, or just generally dominate. But when I amp up and give as hard as I can, we're nearly perfect equals. The difference is that his "default" setting is all in, and I've got to "turn that on."

The result is that I've become very cognizant of just how important it can be to roll with a real sense of urgency and aggression.

At this point it is as if there's a switch in my brain that I flip if it's going to be the kind of competitive roll he gives me or a more lackadaisical approach.

You've got to find your switch. Phone Post 3.0

Sounds like to me you're afraid to commit. That if you go for the sweep you'll miss it and end up in a worse position. This can be overcome by letting go in practice and just go for what you want regardless of the outcome. You don't want to "lose" so you hesitate and the chance passes you by. Trying not to lose actually causes you to lose. You should be having fun. Don't put so much pressure on yourself. Be willing to tap like a mo'fuker. If you don't take chances your progress will be much slower.

Try this mental strategy on the way to practice and say to yourself
"Today is a good day to tap"

As far as competition goes, go with the mindset
"I don't care if I win or lose, I'm just gonna do the best I can"

You free yourself from any outcome and can concentrate in the moment as well as being more relaxed.

Hope this helps.