Shiloh - OP acts like he knows what he talks about. You dont.Also the way you refer to me directly and third person was really weird.
chrisbaker - too soon to tell if it's a good deal or not, op is ignorantI'm saying giving it a chance is a good idea. How is that ignorant. I'm down to jump the bandwagon to hating it when I see evidence fighters make less than they do now with this.
If you don't have to find sponsorships and make more or the same as now how can it be negative.
It is to early to tell so insta bitching doesn't make sense.
The problem I see with the deal is I don't like Reebok at all. I think it is a lower tier brand. I'd rather buy Nike, Under Armor, or MMA specific brands like Bad Boy, Dethrone, etc.
I would consider myself a whale when it comes to buying MMA gear and clothes and basically the fighters won't be getting their 20% from me.
I gotta ask why you guys are so rude on here lol. I have to play devils advocate. There's no one willing to wait. I am. Especially shiloh wtf. I've always been a retard? My goodness.
You guys ruin the ug be fucking nice for once in your life when people disagree jeez.
jitsnbeer -I actually don't disagree with this point. I wish it had been addidas. They've already made a big push into bjj and have been big in judo.
The problem I see with the deal is I don't like Reebok at all. I think it is a lower tier brand. I'd rather buy Nike, Under Armor, or MMA specific brands like Bad Boy, Dethrone, etc.
I would consider myself a whale when it comes to buying MMA gear and clothes and basically the fighters won't be getting their 20% from me.
Jitsnbeer has a legit gripe that is viable now. And I agree with that. There were better brands but reebok isn't the worst by any means.
I'm all for hating on Zuffa. Like with messing up the cung le test. They deserve Hate but it needs to be deserved not just blabbing without any evidence.
it's nice to see other opinions just seems like you're automatically chalking this up to be something great for all fighters, when we're still missing alot of details. We have no idea how significant the deal will be towards fighter pay and how exactly the whole sponsorship thing is gonna play out.
caseharts - I gotta ask why you guys are so rude on here lol. I have to play devils advocate. There's no one willing to wait. I am. Especially shiloh wtf. I've always been a retard? My goodness.Really dude?
You guys ruin the ug be fucking nice for once in your life when people disagree jeez.
You told us to STFU in the thread title, and proceeded to call us all "cry babies" in your very first sentence.
You're a hypocrite man, it's in plain text in this thread for everyone to see. There's no double standard for Chris Hart.
YOU STFU!
you cry baby
peoples are entitled to opinions and shit bro
Hate420 -There's a overwhelming hove mind of hate for this.caseharts - I gotta ask why you guys are so rude on here lol. I have to play devils advocate. There's no one willing to wait. I am. Especially shiloh wtf. I've always been a retard? My goodness.Really dude?
You guys ruin the ug be fucking nice for once in your life when people disagree jeez.
You told us to STFU in the thread title, and proceeded to call us all "cry babies" in your very first sentence.
You're a hypocrite man, it's in plain text in this thread for everyone to see. There's no double standard for Chris Hart.
Yes I could have been nicer. But it wasn't directed at anyone in particular. You are continuing the hive mind by saying 'us'. There are very few facts about this and we're are hating on it for baseless reasons. Why are we assuming the worst in the ufc? Like I know they can be pure Cunts but let's not act like they're the worst or never do good things.
I got tired of the endless threads where no one cited a single good reason for hating this.
I'm sorry in a hypocrite I got people cry babies broadly got their baseless accusations. I get caked a retard for saying give it a chance.
I'll be a hypocrite all day but the ufc hasn't messed up this yet. They can but Damm it feels like everyone is. IL man up to but I don't actually debate people calling them names for the most part. As a ambiguous baseless set yes I will call that names.
Rambo John J - YOU STFU!They are but I like to see actual evidence. That's all in asking.
you cry baby
peoples are entitled to opinions and shit bro
I'm not seeing any. It's just 'it's the ufc they're going to screw everyone'
I need evidence. Like with cung Lee. I'm still upset about that it was really messed up. They need to keep those things private.
IL actually say it. In sorry in my puss poor attitude I called people babies and stfu.
I love differing opinions seriously but have some substance please.
To clarify I was apologizing for calling people cryb babies and saying stfu. Not saying stfu again.
caseharts -Rambo John J - YOU STFU!They are but I like to see actual evidence. That's all in asking.
you cry baby
peoples are entitled to opinions and shit bro
I'm not seeing any. It's just 'it's the ufc they're going to screw everyone'
I need evidence. Like with cung Lee. I'm still upset about that it was really messed up. They need to keep those things private.
I am only pointing our how poorly you worded your thread and the opening post.
Doesn't seem like the case harts I am used to.
UFC doesn't have the greatest track record of taking care of their mid to low end fighters financially and that is fact. 8/8 is a joke when you fight on a PPV that grosses 40-60 million bucks.
Opinions are like assholes, every one has one, and they are very hard to switch out.(whatever that means.)LOL
I still like you, just thought I would return the flavor of the thread title and OP
Rambo John J -Dude when I get passionate I say dumb shit. While I haven't changed my mind I do agree it was poorly worded and rude. I apologized. But my point is no one is standing up and saying there's potential here.caseharts -Rambo John J - YOU STFU!They are but I like to see actual evidence. That's all in asking.
you cry baby
peoples are entitled to opinions and shit bro
I'm not seeing any. It's just 'it's the ufc they're going to screw everyone'
I need evidence. Like with cung Lee. I'm still upset about that it was really messed up. They need to keep those things private.
I am only pointing our how poorly you worded your thread and the opening post.
Doesn't seem like the case harts I am used to.
UFC doesn't have the greatest track record of taking care of their mid to low end fighters financially and that is fact. 8/8 is a joke when you fight on a PPV that grosses 40-60 million bucks.
Opinions are like assholes, every one has one, and they are very hard to switch out.(whatever that means.)LOL
I still like you, just thought I would return the flavor of the thread title and OP
Yes they could screw everyone again but the fact is it could end up being really awesome.
I like to withhold my judgement of something before it exists.
If they really mess this up a union will appear and fighters will control the ufc. Too much money is on the line here.
Whateva. Nate Diaz dont like it, I dont like it.
- You guys think they will make less ? No they explicitly stated effects the lowest ranked fighters will make more tab they ever did with sponsorships.
--without knowing how much the lowest ranked fighters made before and after the deal this is impossible to tell. but it is very possible they may make less. it's also possible some will make more
3. That fighters won't like this? Outside of nate who is upset? 99 percent will line this.
--again we don't and they don't know the full details. it's hard to form an opinion one way or the other at this point
4. None of you have dealt with sponsorship you act like it it's easy or fun for fighters to secure sponsors. It's not. This is way better for them just there even if there's no increase in pay. Phone Post 3.0
--while not having to find sponsors is a positive, if they do make less that would be a negative
5. That unranked guys who have big names will suffer. No they won't. They will still make more than other fighters. Ufc all pays them way more and they get 20 percent of revenue of their product.
If anything its okay because the other guys will get a solid wage. Worth the trade off if there is one at all.
--not sure how you came to this conclusion. if an unranked fighter was pulling in huge sponsor dollars, and now they get less, they will suffer. even if they make more than other fighters, it's still possible they are making less than they originally were.
6. The rankings. Yes they're not the best. But Lorenzo and Dana said explicitly that would be over hauled. I mean are they always truthful ? No. But this isn't hard to fix
--dana's plan for overhauling it is worthless. any credible media member will not participate due to the conflict of interest that directly affects fighter pay. the ufc should instead use its own internal rankings.
7. Other brands will be hurt. Yes a few will. The few that could afford the tax. Venus badboy? While I feel for them units they were willing to take on the entire roster than there's no issue. That's a huge opportunity if they wanted it.
--While it sucks very few others are hurt and I can't imagine that being terrible.
i mean this deal kills a lot of MMA brands, but to me this isn't a big deal
8. Almost every other big league or sports team has similar deals. Everyone seems fine. Why is it so wrong here? it's guaranteed money with increases at higher ranks.
This has NO AFFECT on normal pay this is seperate
--the problem is, we have been told that sponsorships are essentially normal pay. it's one reason dana has pushed down our throats to rationalize the regular low pay. also those other sports leagues have unions, which means the players were able to collectively bargain their share of the deal. none of that happened here.
9. Similar to 8. If a fighter like Brock comes over again he will still negotiate his pay and on top of that get reebok money.
We all want better fighter pay. Ignoring that this is a potential step in the right direction is silly. Could they screw this up? Yes. Will they ? Who knows. If they don't it will be good stop being so damn negative.
--well brock was getting huge sponsorship money, if he will returns he will be getting unranked fighter money. his sponsorships were so huge that WWE let him perform with those sponsor patches. he would get killed on this type of deal.
http://www.twitlonger.com/show/nhls0f
from brent brookhouse
let's assume that the $70,000,000 over 6 years is true. That is 11,666,666/year. Round up to $11,700,000 for ease. $11,700,000 divided by the 550 current active members of the UFC roster is $21,273/a year per fighter. HOWEVER...we know that top tier guys are going to make far more than guys ranked 11-15 who are going to make more than the unranked guys. So...how much of a boost do we really think this gives an unranked guy per year? MAYBE $5,000? Could an unranked guy previously get $2,500 per fight if he fought twice a year? Is it such a boost that it's a "great thing?"
Team GDP - 1. You guys think they will make less ? No they explicitly stated effects the lowest ranked fighters will make more tab they ever did with sponsorships.
--without knowing how much the lowest ranked fighters made before and after the deal this is impossible to tell. but it is very possible they may make less. it's also possible some will make more
3. That fighters won't like this? Outside of nate who is upset? 99 percent will line this.
--again we don't and they don't know the full details. it's hard to form an opinion one way or the other at this point
4. None of you have dealt with sponsorship you act like it it's easy or fun for fighters to secure sponsors. It's not. This is way better for them just there even if there's no increase in pay. Phone Post 3.0
--while not having to find sponsors is a positive, if they do make less that would be a negative
5. That unranked guys who have big names will suffer. No they won't. They will still make more than other fighters. Ufc all pays them way more and they get 20 percent of revenue of their product.
If anything its okay because the other guys will get a solid wage. Worth the trade off if there is one at all.
--not sure how you came to this conclusion. if an unranked fighter was pulling in huge sponsor dollars, and now they get less, they will suffer. even if they make more than other fighters, it's still possible they are making less than they originally were.
6. The rankings. Yes they're not the best. But Lorenzo and Dana said explicitly that would be over hauled. I mean are they always truthful ? No. But this isn't hard to fix
--dana's plan for overhauling it is worthless. any credible media member will not participate due to the conflict of interest that directly affects fighter pay. the ufc should instead use its own internal rankings.
7. Other brands will be hurt. Yes a few will. The few that could afford the tax. Venus badboy? While I feel for them units they were willing to take on the entire roster than there's no issue. That's a huge opportunity if they wanted it.
--While it sucks very few others are hurt and I can't imagine that being terrible.
i mean this deal kills a lot of MMA brands, but to me this isn't a big deal
8. Almost every other big league or sports team has similar deals. Everyone seems fine. Why is it so wrong here? it's guaranteed money with increases at higher ranks.
This has NO AFFECT on normal pay this is seperate
--the problem is, we have been told that sponsorships are essentially normal pay. it's one reason dana has pushed down our throats to rationalize the regular low pay. also those other sports leagues have unions, which means the players were able to collectively bargain their share of the deal. none of that happened here.
9. Similar to 8. If a fighter like Brock comes over again he will still negotiate his pay and on top of that get reebok money.
We all want better fighter pay. Ignoring that this is a potential step in the right direction is silly. Could they screw this up? Yes. Will they ? Who knows. If they don't it will be good stop being so damn negative.
--well brock was getting huge sponsorship money, if he will returns he will be getting unranked fighter money. his sponsorships were so huge that WWE let him perform with those sponsor patches. he would get killed on this type of deal.
you make a few valid points but mostly that your assuming it could be negative but The UFC explicitly said the guys making the the least will at the very least be making what they made and said theyd make more. Now will that hold true? If it does than this is awesome outside of a few outliers this can be amazing for fighters.
Now if they make less then it will suck. but if its the same or more then its awesome that is what it comes down to and July next year is when it starts correct? we should really evaluate our opinions then. Until then I will say go for it because any way of potentially increasing fighter pay at the lower levels im up for. I want to see the up and comers not struggle as much. This has the potential to do that and ELIMINATES managers. Which would be awesome. More money in the fighters pockets.
Team GDP - http://www.twitlonger.com/show/nhls0f
from brent brookhouse
let's assume that the $70,000,000 over 6 years is true. That is 11,666,666/year. Round up to $11,700,000 for ease. $11,700,000 divided by the 550 current active members of the UFC roster is $21,273/a year per fighter. HOWEVER...we know that top tier guys are going to make far more than guys ranked 11-15 who are going to make more than the unranked guys. So...how much of a boost do we really think this gives an unranked guy per year? MAYBE $5,000? Could an unranked guy previously get $2,500 per fight if he fought twice a year? Is it such a boost that it's a "great thing?"
like I said potentially. If its at the very least the same money its a good thing. My issue is the sponsor tax. While I get it I just wish the UFC put someone in charge of accepting and denying sponsors based on their own criteria rather than purely money. but if we seperate this from the sponsor tax as long as they make the same it should be good but I think the deal is more than that. Fox is paying 100million a year. this is what 6.2 mill a year ? I doubt its that low. If it is several smaller brands could have gotten in on this.
unless someone can cite that its exactly 70 million i wouldnt put much weight into these numbers.