The Official MMA Ontario thread

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1

From Ken Hayashi as to why there is no MMA in Ontario:

"Dear Mr.Nemeth

Please be advised that under the Athletics control Act and Regulations the Office of the Athletics Commissioner has the authority to sanction professional boxing, boxing with the hands and feet (kickboxing) and wrestling. And any that any other combative sport that is not recognized under the Athletics Control Act, or any amateur combative sport that is not recognized by the Ministry of Tourism & Recreation, falls under section 83 of the Canadian Criminal Code.

To have Mixed Martial Arts legalized it will take legislative changes to both the Canadian Criminal Code and to the regulations under the Athletics Control Act. One would have to lobby both the Federal and Provincial governments to seek legislative amendments."

From: Antico Interview

Ken said the exact same thing to me. Probably word for word. Also....

MA: "how can Quebec allow MMA if section 83 is worded as is?"

KH: "they perhaps open themselves up to liability by doing so."

MA: "so in essence, anyone who sanctions MMA in Canada is in contradiction to s83 and thus guily of a criminal offence. Correct?"

KH: "I don't know but who's going to charge them? You'd have to get yourself a lawyer I guess to argue about that."

MA: "why can't Ontario do what Quebec is doing?"

KH: "I've contacted our legal dep't and they've stated that we cannot make changes to the Athletics Control Act until the wording in section 83 is changed".

MA: "Is there anything one can do to try and change the minds of the Ontario gov't on this?"

KH: "I don't know, it's not up to me".

MA: "Who would you suggest I contact?"

KH: "You'd have to lobby the gov't. I am not able to advise the best way to do that."

MA: "So in essence, you are only responsible for ensuring the Athletics Control Act is adhered to. You are not responsible for changing it. Correct."

KH: "Yes, exactly."

MA: "May I ask what your opinion is of MMA or is that not even relevant."

KH: "Exactly, I'm completely indifferent. If the province chose to allow MMA tomorrow I'd be fine with it."

2

So, contact your MP and MPPs!

3

Section 83 of the Federal Criminal Code stated below:

"PART II OFFENCES AGAINST PUBLIC ORDER
Prize Fights
Engaging in prize fight

  1. (1) Every one who

(a) engages as a principal in a prize fight,

(b) advises, encourages or promotes a prize fight, or

(c) is present at a prize fight as an aid, second, surgeon, umpire, backer or reporter,

is guilty of an offence punishable on summary conviction.

Definition of "prize fight"
(2) In this section, "prize fight" means an encounter or fight with fists or hands between two persons who have met for that purpose by previous arrangement made by or for them, but a boxing contest between amateur sportsmen, where the contestants wear boxing gloves of not less than one hundred and forty grams each in mass, or any boxing contest held with the permission or under the authority of an athletic board or commission or similar body established by or under the authority of the legislature of a province for the control of sport within the province, shall be deemed not to be a prize fight.

R.S., 1985, c. C-46, s. 83; R.S., 1985, c. 27 (1st Supp.), s. 186."

4

You can contact your own MP requesting change to Sec 83 by clicking here and finding your riding.

5

Another forum member has forwarded an e-mail he has already sent to his MP. I will not use his name as I do not have his permission to do so but here is a blank that people can use to send to their MP.

"Dear (insert member of parliment name)

As one of your constituents, I would like you to
consider my request for your help to have Section 83 of the Criminal Code amended either through a Private Members Bill or if possible a government bill, which would allow the sanctioning of Mixed Martial Arts events in Ontario.

Section 83 of the Federal Criminal Code stated
below:

"PART II OFFENCES AGAINST PUBLIC
ORDERPrize FightsEngaging in prize fight 83. (1) Every one
who

(a) engages as a principal in a prize
fight,

(b) advises, encourages or promotes a prize
fight, or

(c) is present at a prize fight as an aid,
second, surgeon, umpire, backer or reporter,

is guilty of an offence punishable on
summary conviction. Definition of "prize fight" (2)

In this section, "prize fight" means an encounter or fight with fists or hands between two persons who have met for that purpose by previous arrangement made by or for them, but a boxing contest between amateur sportsmen, where the contestants wear boxing gloves of not less than one hundred and forty grams each in mass, or any boxing contest held with the permission or under the authority of an athletic board or commission or similar body established by or under the authority of the legislature of a province for the control of sport within the province, shall be deemed not to be a prize fight.

R.S., 1985, c. C-46, s. 83; R.S., 1985, c. 27 (1st Supp.), s. 186."

This code is archaic and impeding the ability for promoters to put on MMA (Mixed Martial Arts) events, fans to watch the sport in Ontario and MMA athletes from Ontario to partake in the sport within their own province. It is also taking away the economic benefits these events would bring to Ontario.

The province of Quebec has long amended provincial
legislation to allow the sanctioning of MMA events and many of the other provinces are following suit. The City of Vernon, B.C. has just passed a
municipal by-law to allow the formation of an Athletics Commission to hold such events. Ontario though does not allow for municipalities to override
Ontario's Athletics Control Act.

Mr. Ken Hayashi is Ontario's Athletics Commissioner
and states that there has to be an amendment to Section 83 to allow the sanctioning of MMA events and I quote:

"Please be advised that under the Athletics
control Act and Regulations the Office of the Athletics Commissioner has the authority to sanction professional boxing, boxing with the hands and feet
(kickboxing) and wrestling. And any that any other combative sport that is not recognized under the Athletics Control Act, or any amateur combative sport that is not recognized by the Ministry of Tourism & Recreation, falls under section 83 of the Canadian Criminal Code.

To have Mixed Martial Arts legalized it will take legislative changes to both the Canadian Criminal Code and to the regulations under the Athletics Control Act. One would have to lobby both the
Federal and Provincial governments to seek legislative amendments."

Mr. Hayashi also said in an interview much of the
same, that there needs to be an amendment to section 83 and here is part of that interview:

MA: "how can Quebec allow MMA if section 83 is worded as is?"

KH: "they perhaps open themselves up to liability by doing so."

MA: "so in essence, anyone who sanctions MMA in Canada is in contradiction to S83 and thus guilty of a criminal offence. Correct?"

KH: "I don't know but who's going to charge them? You'd have to get yourself a lawyer I guess to argue about that."

MA: "why can't Ontario do what Quebec is doing?"

KH: "I've contacted our legal dep't and they've stated that we cannot make changes to the Athletics Control Act until the wording in section 83 is changed".

MA: "Is there anything one can do to try and change the minds of the Ontario gov't on this?"

KH: "I don't know, it's not up to me".

MA: "Who would you suggest I contact?"

KH: "You'd have to lobby the gov't. I am not able to advise the best way to do that."

MA: "So in essence, you are only responsible for ensuring the Athletics Control Act is adhered to. You are not responsible for changing it. Correct."

KH: "Yes, exactly."

MA: "May I ask what your opinion is of MMA or is that not even relevant."

KH: "Exactly, I'm completely indifferent.
If the province chose to allow MMA tomorrow I'd be fine with it."

(Insert MP's name here), I hope you will consider my request for your help to try and have Section 83 of the Criminal Code amended and I look forward to your response.

Regards,
(insert your name here)

6

Just to clarify (perhaps it's obvious to some but not to others),

Your MP is for federal member of parliament.  They should be contacted about section 83 of Canada's Criminal Code.  BUT, you should tell your MP where you want the letter sent.  I have NOT yet concluded who this should be sent to on a federal level.

Your MPP is your provincial member of parliament.  They should be forwarding your concerns to the Minter of Business and Consumer Services, Jim Watson.

BUT, you don't even need to go through your MP/MPP I believe.  I've been advised by a senior policy advisor in one of the ministries that the minster responsible for administering these acts are obligated to respond to every letter.  Going through your local MP/MPP may or may not strengthen your case.

Please be kind in your letters.  No "why the fuck isn't MMA legal you bastards?" please :)  Talk about the proven safety record of the sport and other good things. 

There's more stuff I'm currently looking into.  In the next couple of weeks I'll be starting something so that we can speak as a group of concerned Ontario citizens.

Regards,

Marco

7

It's not up to you who these should be sent to.

The Minister of Justice is responsible for the criminal code.

His name is Hon. Irwin Cotler
Telephone: (613) 995-0121
Fax: (613) 992-6762
Email: Cotler.I@parl.gc.ca

Hill Office, House of Commons, Ottawa, Ontario,
K1A 0A6

Constituency Office, 4770 Kent Avenue Suite 316,
Montréal, Quebec, H3W1H2

Your MP should direct you to this man as well as make your concern known in the house.

8

9

Thanks Dougie for all your hard work and info !

10

I'm not sure where it is going but if we all get involved I am sure good things will come of it.

Our Mp's and MPP's are there to serve us and the needs of the people.

We should use these services, after all, we pay them to do stuff for us. We elect them.

11

As a result of many e-mails flying to my e-mail box, at this point I would like to openly state that I am in no way working with Marco Antico in getting MMA events sanctioned and running in Ontario any more than any other person might.

He has his own agenda in regards to this issue which I am of no part. I will be posting my results in further threads but for now I will discontinue discussing this as he and I are going in different directions.

I would rather our methods not be confused as coming from the same desk. I have no affliation with Mr. Antico either professionaly or personally other than someone I have corresponded with occasionally.

I belong to no group or organization looking to see MMA sanctioned. I am just a fan who wants to see it happen in my province. That is my only goal.

I wish him the best of luck in his work.

12

^HAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAH

It's both funny and sad that you feel the need to say something like this.

"He has his own agenda in regards to this issue which I am of no part. "

WTF does that mean? The only agenda I have is to see MMA legalized in Ontario. Is that not your agenda too? Did you think TKO put me up to this or something? Do you think I'm going to lobby the gov't and say "you must include a clause that says only TKO are allowed to hold events in the province"?????? LMFAO!

This has nothing to do with TKO. It has nothing to do with anything except in getting MMA legalized in Ontario.

Whatever dude, good luck to you too.

BTW - I've already received tons of private emails of people who support my efforts in this matter. It's kinda sad they don't say here what they've said to me privately. Oh well, doesn't really matter. I very much appreciate their emails nonetheless.

The MMA world is much, much bigger then the Canadian UG forum.

13

Uh, I just don't agree with the way you work. I just have a bad feeling about it.

That's it.

Nothing else.

Not sure where the rest of what you posted came from. Seriously...what's up with that?

I am beginning to wonder about you man. The last post is an example why I have a bad feeling and don't want to work with you.

Cheers.

14

okie dokie

cheers

15

Leave this to people who are actually involved in MMA, Marco. And, no, you sitting ringside at TKO events and writing for minor websites does not make you involved in MMA. You are just a fan. Don't ever get confused.

You're gonna fuck this up for everybody.

16

Thanks Dougie for all the time and hard work you put into this. I just sent out an email to my MP! Let's get the ball rolling people!!

17

"You're gonna fuck this up for everybody."

This is what my bad feeling about this tells me, which is why I don't want people to think I am working with Marco.

Sorry Marco. You just come across as too much, "It's all about me and what I can do for myself" despite what you say.

I just have the feeling that you'd sell yourself out the first chance you'd get and do it on the backs of the rest of us.

I hope I am wrong.

Best of luck.

18

So you're afraid that I'd get MMA legalized and then bring in cheap Mexican labor to run the events and keep the good Ontario citizens out? C'mon dude. You just don't make any sense.

Do you know how many calls MPPs/MPs get in one day? Everything from snow removal, to a dog shitting on their lawn, to neibourhood breakins. Where do you think legalizing a combat sport ranks in their priorities to get re-elected to office? I think this legalizing MMA effort requires more focus and co-operative effort.

But you know what? It doesn't hurt so go right ahead and encourage everyone to contact their local politicians.

We'll go about it from different angles and hope someone reaches the finish line.

Regards,
Marco

19

Well, I am not going to continue to argue this with you Marco.

Once again you prove that you won't see any side of an issue that isn't yours.

Exactly why I don't want people thinking we're working together.

You are reminding me of a snake oil saleman come to town selling something you claim to be wonderous.

Now you don't promise that it will cure all that ails us.

In fact you state "We make absolutely no promises on the likelihood of success. We only promise that we will do our best to go about pursuing this worthy cause in what we deem to be the most appropriate manner."

But you heavily imply that this cure will be all that we dream of. All of course done under the guise of the royal "We". Of course the "we" is really only you running the show.

You get people excited, you get them believing. You get them into it. You take what you can from them.

Here's the problem. When it goes bad, and it usually does, I don't want to be the one holding the bag while you skip off.

That's my bad feeling about you. The worst part is that I think you've done this before with things like events that never came to be.

So I think I will pay no attention to smoke and mirrors and walk away from the man behind the curtain.

There is an old saying. Instead of learning the tricks of the trade...learn the trade.

20

This is the exact reason I avoid situations like this....

In the three years I've been a member here I can confidently say I have made alot of great friends in this business and JUST as many connections.

I've learned alot about this business and continue to learn from some of the best in the business but this is where it stops...

I know my role.

That role is a fan.

Thankfully I've never had misconceptions of being anything more.

Good luck and be careful with what you are attempting but as I fan, please.... DON'T FUCK THIS UP. This could easily turn into a shit storm that holds the sport up even longer.