The best base for MMA is being a mentally tough SOB who's willing to train hard, fight hard, and not give up.
Period.
FacepunchPOW - The best base for MMA is being a mentally tough SOB who's willing to train hard, fight hard, and not give up.
Period.
Exactly!
Thats what these NCAA give these guys with their wrestling programs. But like I said other sports do the same thing. To keep using this wrestling is the best base thing is absurd.
And either way you look at it Diego smoked a high level NCAA wrestler knowing very little wrestling. BJJ trumped all those years of high level wrestling.
judom - LOL at trying to escape an obvious fact...right now, NCAA wrestling base has proven the best base for MMA.Chicken dinner, right here!!
These dudes can pick-up BJJ very fast. Good luck picking up NCAA level wrestling in 2 years. Stann tried to do that and got his ass taken down by Sonnen fast.
In modern MMA, with short 3x5 min rounds, dictating where the fight takes place is HUGE, perhaps the most important aspect of the fight.
Ask any MMA fighter, if they were 19, and had 5 years, where would they train: under John Smith at Oklahoma State, Tom Brands at Iowa, Cael Sanderson at Penn State...or you would rather train BJJ under pick any random BJJ world champion ?
Everyone will tell you the wrestling because it is way harder to pick up, it builds much better athleticism and toughness. Once you have a good wrestling background, the BJJ you need for MMA is not much and it is a hell of a lot easier to pick up than high level wrestling.
Note that I am not saying wrestling > bjj, I am saying NCAA level wrestling is a way better base for MMA than any level of BJJ.
And we will see that more and more in North American MMA: NCAA level wrestlers will dominate it (now more and more are crossing over).
jerky66 - And either way you look at it Diego smoked a high level NCAA wrestler knowing very little wrestling. BJJ trumped all those years of high level wrestling.Dude, you're going under the assumption that wrestling nuthuggers, like myself, think that a wrestler will ALWAYS beat non-wrestlers. Nobody's saying that. Chill the fuck out with your blind nonsensical BJJ ranting.
It takes a wrestler less time to learn boxing and BJJ, than it does a BJJer to learn boxing and wrestling or a boxer to learn wrestling and BJJ.
Wrestlers are all around the better atlhletes. To deny that is really ignorant.
It's mma have to know it all and be great at all. Muay Thai, BJJ, and how to wrestle. IMO the first two are more important as they possess the skills to end fights. Wrestling while extremely important does not. But must be trained to compliment bjj fighters to take their opponents down and for Strikers to keep it standing as well as enable them to take their opponents down to mix it up and set up bigger strikes. 
judom - jerky66,
dude...one thing we know from MMA today is that:
15 years of wrestling @NCAA + 2 years of BJJ >> 15 years of BJJ + 2 years of wrestling.
Look at the base of all champions today...
HW:
--
Champion:
JDS - Boxing
Carwin - Wrestling
Cain - Wrestling
Brock - Wrestling
Overeem - Striking
Nog - BJJ
Mir - BJJ ?
LHW:
---
Champion:
Jones - Wrestling
Davis - Wrestling
Evans - Wrestling
Henderson - Wrestling
Jackson - Wrestling/Boxing
Machida - Karate
Shogun - Striking
MW:
__
Champion:
Silva - Striking
Sonnen - Wrestling
Munoz - Wrestling
Bisping - Striking
Maia - BJJ
Palhares - BJJ
...
WW:
__
Champion:
GSP - Karate (?). Nowadays a Wrestler mostly.
Kosheck - Wrestling
Hughes - Wrestling
Fitch - Wrestling
BJ - BJJ
Pitbull - Striking
Then you got wrestlers like Ellenberger, Faber, and others like Cormier, Lawal that are stars already..
Sure, you need some form of submission training mostly to defend but that is a hell of a lot easier to learn than high level wrestling.
The pajama fags will never learn and every sub you hear this shit bjj>wrestling but it's not the case there is a reason bjj was invented within the last 100 years and wrestling has been around forever I think if you gave Cael Sanderson in his prime 3 years jitz training he beats anyone near his wieght
GageIsLegend -jerky66 -judom - wrestling is the best base for MMA. BJJ dudes are like the ninjas from the 80's...very concerned to keep their 'so dangerous' image...LOL
Best base this, best base that. Thats all you hear from these wrestliing nut huggers until they get there arms broken or choked out.
Wrestling is the only style in MMA that does not finish. Muay Thai guys can rely on that if they learn to stuff the takedown-Martin Kampmann. BJJ guys kill wrestlers in the ground without knowing any wrestling. A boxer will kill a wrestler if they stuff the takedowns- look what JDS did to Cain. He knocked the wrestler the hell out.
Wrestlers on the other hand have to learn another style and make it as important as their wrestling. Chael is learning this now which is why he will get better. He finally learned that he has to good at BJJ. The wrestlers who dont end up getting there asses whooped every time.Lol jerky you mad bro?
Stuffing a take down there's a word for that isn't there? Oh yeah a sprawl sprawling is a defensive wrestling techinique so in order for someone to sprawl on a wrestler they have to understand a takedown
I've never met someone that can sprawl on a real wrestler without being taken down sometime prior you can't learn a sprawl without being taken down first
Why would I be mad? BJJ prevailed.
To the wrestlers are the best athletes guy. First of all I acknowledged they were awesome athletes. The thing is though so are defensive college lineman. No one ever answered my Matt Mitrione fact. He never wrestled but was a high level athlete and look how good he is doing. Wrestling is not better than any other high level sport. I maintain the reason wrestlers do well is because they are sick athletes not because it is the best base. The best base would probably be Muay Thai becuse all fights start standing and you have to know that. I am saying this and I am a BJJ guy. How can wrestling be the best base when it does not finish fights?
I have all the respect in the world for high level wrestlers but had to say something after Burmudez said he did not need BJJ because he had wrestling. Do you think he feels that way now? I am also sick of hearing this "it is the best base" nonsense.
"It takes a wrestler less time to learn boxing and BJJ, than it does a BJJer to learn boxing and wrestling or a boxer to learn wrestling and BJJ"
A wrestler will learn BJJ faster than a BJJ guy will learn wrestling? That all depends on who you are dealing with and can never cover every scenario. There was a kid who grew up doing BJJ who got a scholarship to wrestle at Iowa.
Also; there is no way a wrestler learns boxing any quicker than a BJJ guy or any other type of grappler.
jerky66 - "It takes a wrestler less time to learn boxing and BJJ, than it does a BJJer to learn boxing and wrestling or a boxer to learn wrestling and BJJ"
A wrestler will learn BJJ faster than a BJJ guy will learn wrestling? That all depends on who you are dealing with and can never cover every scenario. There was a kid who grew up doing BJJ who got a scholarship to wrestle at Iowa.
Also; there is no way a wrestler learns boxing any quicker than a BJJ guy or any other type of grappler.
Maybe because bjj don't start standing wrestlers learn body control while standing which is useful in boxing bjj guys notoriously have a hard time learning take downs and takedown defense
The Sorta Kinda MMA Guru -jerky66 - "It takes a wrestler less time to learn boxing and BJJ, than it does a BJJer to learn boxing and wrestling or a boxer to learn wrestling and BJJ"Maybe because bjj don't start standing wrestlers learn body control while standing which is useful in boxing bjj guys notoriously have a hard time learning take downs and takedown defense <img src="/images/phone/apple.png" alt="Phone Post" border="0" style="vertical-align:middle;"/>
A wrestler will learn BJJ faster than a BJJ guy will learn wrestling? That all depends on who you are dealing with and can never cover every scenario. There was a kid who grew up doing BJJ who got a scholarship to wrestle at Iowa.
Also; there is no way a wrestler learns boxing any quicker than a BJJ guy or any other type of grappler.
The reason that they are so bad at takedowns is the fault of current BJJ schools. They let to many of their students start sparring sessions on there knees. That is just very stupid. I will concede your point on the takedowns.
"Like Chael said submissions are for cowards"
You are a serious idiot for making that statement. Chael only said that becasue he kept getting submitted. Did Chael say that same thing when he submitted Brian Stann? Was Chael a coward for submitting someone? Idiot!
BJJ already has the rules stacked in its favor over wrestling, or do you think knees to a downed opponent would favor BJJ over wrestling?
If you find me a BJJ school that stresses control and positioning as much as an average high school wrestling program then I'd say that particular brand of BJJ would be as good a base for MMA as wrestling.
But then again that's not our current reality.
jerky66 - "It takes a wrestler less time to learn boxing and BJJ, than it does a BJJer to learn boxing and wrestling or a boxer to learn wrestling and BJJ"
A wrestler will learn BJJ faster than a BJJ guy will learn wrestling? That all depends on who you are dealing with and can never cover every scenario. There was a kid who grew up doing BJJ who got a scholarship to wrestle at Iowa.
Also; there is no way a wrestler learns boxing any quicker than a BJJ guy or any other type of grappler.
What's the kid's name?
Twenty47 -jerky66 - "Like Chael said submissions are for cowards"Admit I was trolling but my part about ass beating was not. How Diego best his ass by arm barring him? When I grapple with good bjj guys sure i will get caught in subs here and there but it's a sure thing the other guy will be the one who wakes up the next morning feeling like he got jumped by 10 people. This is a sport not real life or death combat. Bjj guys live in denial and always say "oh well if you didn't tap I'd have choked you to death or broke your arm". Guess what man that will never happen because both are sports with rules. If some bjj guy wants to kill me I'm not gonna use my wrestling to prove anything I'm gonna shoot you or use whatever weapon I can. And if I had no choice I like my chances in life or death. Getting spiked onto a mat is different than getting smashed into cement. No you won't hold onto that choke or arm bar. So I hope u sleep well at night knowing you made me tap your hand doing no damage and I wore out your whole body with wrestling and put your teeth through your lip with cross faces. End rant/ <img src="/images/phone/apple.png" alt="Phone Post" border="0" style="vertical-align:middle;"/>
You are a serious idiot for making that statement. Chael only said that becasue he kept getting submitted. Did Chael say that same thing when he submitted Brian Stann? Was Chael a coward for submitting someone? Idiot!
Whatever helps you sleep at night pal
Twenty47 -jerky66 - "Like Chael said submissions are for cowards"Admit I was trolling but my part about ass beating was not. How Diego best his ass by arm barring him? When I grapple with good bjj guys sure i will get caught in subs here and there but it's a sure thing the other guy will be the one who wakes up the next morning feeling like he got jumped by 10 people. This is a sport not real life or death combat. Bjj guys live in denial and always say "oh well if you didn't tap I'd have choked you to death or broke your arm". Guess what man that will never happen because both are sports with rules. If some bjj guy wants to kill me I'm not gonna use my wrestling to prove anything I'm gonna shoot you or use whatever weapon I can. And if I had no choice I like my chances in life or death. Getting spiked onto a mat is different than getting smashed into cement. No you won't hold onto that choke or arm bar. So I hope u sleep well at night knowing you made me tap your hand doing no damage and I wore out your whole body with wrestling and put your teeth through your lip with cross faces. End rant/ <img src="/images/phone/apple.png" alt="Phone Post" border="0" style="vertical-align:middle;"/>
You are a serious idiot for making that statement. Chael only said that becasue he kept getting submitted. Did Chael say that same thing when he submitted Brian Stann? Was Chael a coward for submitting someone? Idiot!
nothing you say makes any sense
SinCityHustler -jerky66 - "It takes a wrestler less time to learn boxing and BJJ, than it does a BJJer to learn boxing and wrestling or a boxer to learn wrestling and BJJ"
A wrestler will learn BJJ faster than a BJJ guy will learn wrestling? That all depends on who you are dealing with and can never cover every scenario. <b>There was a kid who grew up doing BJJ who got a scholarship to wrestle at Iowa.
</b>Also; there is no way a wrestler learns boxing any quicker than a BJJ guy or any other type of grappler.
What's the kid's name?
I was just trying to google it. I saw it on a inside mma episode or something. Short, thin, white kid with a short blonde hair.
Kostakio - Bermudez beats Brandao 9 out of 10 times.
right, 9 times he wins in imagination land. the 10th time he loses in the real world where most of us currently reside