I was test years ago and the Dr. told me I am eligible for TRT, When i found the possible side effects, I declined.
I'm just a few months from 60 and I take no medication, except occasional ibu's when my pain is becoming intolerable.
ckur how does eddie feel about them?,i know he condone them,ppl say he thought about using them when he was getting heavy . did you talk him out of it
I honestly thought that it was BS and that people around my age (40) should experience a significant decline in testosterone. Thus, the "average" range should be lower and the decline should be exhibited as you get into the 30s and so on. I was thinking that sure, most people who go and get it tested ARE going to see less than 500 or whatever the norm is if they are older.
The biggest reason is that I really haven't seen people say "I got tested, I was NORMAL. Don't need it."
Well, I had mine done and it was 540. Never done steroids in my life except Dr prescribed cortisone (or whatever) in my knee shots. (edit to clarify, I'm leery of steroids and absolutely do not take them, but I'm interested from a health/biological perspective as I may face the choice in the future. The benefits seem compelling.)
So I'm about to turn 41, in the normal range. If you exhibit low testosterone, makes sense to me to at least try to bring it up to normal. Personally, I'd err on the side of caution, so if you are at 200, try to get to 400 or whatever instead of 600+. I would first though look into diet as mentioned, always the best way.
cheers
iVaporize -LCSULLA -iVaporize - also share if your a past steroid user
trt probably gonna send u to an early grave
Your evidence? Or do you just comment without knowing what your talking about?
just use google... do i need to post a lmgtfy link??
Well, I think it does get a little complicated. For example, if you are low and suddenly introduce a bunch of testosterone into your system, perhaps that affects your metabolism in a manner that e.g. causes all of the cholesterol in your system to be deposited into your arteries so they clog at an alarming rate.
OTOH, if you slowly bring the levels back to normal, I'd be interested in the biological mechanism that causes detrimental effects that wouldn't otherwise occur if you were at normal levels.
In other words, let's assume that the "Bad thing" that happens with TRT is an increase in bad cholesterol. It could be any number of things, this is just an example. If your test drops naturally, you should see the corresponding mechanism at work (e.g. LDL decrease).
I'm not saying this is what happens. I am asking why you feel there is a greater probability of trt-induced mortality, what would be the cause if it's not simply higher T = higher LDL... which means people with naturally higher T are at a greater risk. Thus it becomes easer to assess the risk vs. reward.
iVaporize -LCSULLA -iVaporize - also share if your a past steroid user
trt probably gonna send u to an early grave
Your evidence? Or do you just comment without knowing what your talking about?
just use google... do i need to post a lmgtfy link??
"Use google"...lol. Find documented evidence by either research scientists or doctors, not wiki or some rag newspaper. And not one doctor...but studies saying TRT will kill you. And you seem to get confussed by TRT and what BBers take. Its like the difference between having a few beers and being raging alcholic.
And you're falling into the trap of believing whatever you read on the internet. If I did a google search for pitbull I would find dozens of news articles of pitbulls being crazy killers. But CDC has them like fourth or fifth when it comes to bites and they classify any dog that looks pit a pit...even if its a mutt.
A lot of you get some notion in your head and run full steam without actual looking at the issue.
I think most of the people on this thread are completly uninformed and some maybe have their ego holding them back. "Im 60 and I dont need that stuff. I eat healthy and take my vitamins." LOL
Some of you remind me of my grandfather that use ask my cousin if he was gay because he liked to lift weights. "Men dont do that gay crap.".. was his response. Now everyone advocates weightlifting to keep strength into old age. Seventy years ago everyone thought pot made men rapists and made them give into their base personality. Whatever. I imagine TRT, in the future, will have the same evolution with anyone wanting a solid quality of life.
If you tried it and didnt like it then fine. If you want your body to be a temple then fine. But not at least looking into it with a critical eye...
Ther only points I agree with the naysayers is that too many people jump right on it without looking at the issue. And that anything in excess isnt healthy: TRT, food alchol, asprin...except maybe sex. Yeah Ill go with that last one.
I think part of the problem is that TRT is in the same orbit as the "PEDs" and "steroids" we've been told forever is bad for us.
PED abusers in sports are (rightfully, IMO) labeled "cheats," we've got inumerable stories of bodybuilders and former NFLers that have all sorts of terrible side effects after their days of abusing massive quantities of steroids, includng testosterone. So when someone mentions testosterone supplementation, it has a negative conotation deep in our minds. Many of us can't help but feel it's "got to" be bad for us in some way.
It's similar to what you run into when you hear folks rant against the "dangers" of marijuana. It's been associated with far more dangerous drugs for so long now and subject to so much dogma, that it's hard from some people to objectively consider whether marijuana really belongs in the same regulatory category as heroin, cocaine, and meth. It's just all "bad" and "dangerous" to them.
Perhaps even low levels of TRT over extended periods of time will eventually be shown to be dangerous. But that's not necessarily true, and we do seem comfortable taking other substances for huge spans of time. Daily aspirins, three cups of coffee a day, a beer after work every day, daily multivitamins, blood pressure medication, cholesterol medication, etc. There are many things that many folks take for years and years on end, and we don't seem terribly worried about it.
But something about testosterone . . . it just makes folks more nervous. I really think it's the PED connection--that stuff is bad, so this (very similar but much smaller dose) stuff must also be bad.
The problem though is that's not a particularly logical conclusion. A beer a day is a lot different than 10 beers a day, and demonstrable proof that 10 beers a day will eventually send me into liver failure literally means nothing about the long term effects of one beer a day. Just as proof that 40 multivitamins every morning will eventually destroy my kidneys is irrelevant as to whether I should take one multivitamin every morning.
It'll be interesting to see how it shakes out over the next few decades. Personally, while I acknowledge it could be true that even low dose TRT is bad for us over time, I think it's just as likely that we'll find low doses of testosterone over the middle age years and into the senior years could actually be GOOD for you.
Perhaps we'll find that folks on long term (but LOW dose) TRT in fact live longer on average. Perhaps the long term studies will show that TRT kept them physically sturdier, provided stronger immune systems, and kept them mentally clearer, with the result being a longer life span on average. Who knows? I don't think that's a ridiculous possibility. We'll have to wait and see.
LCSULLA - I think most of the people on this thread are completly uninformed and some maybe have their ego holding them back. "Im 60 and I dont need that stuff. I eat healthy and take my vitamins." LOLVoted up.
Some of you remind me of my grandfather that use ask my cousin if he was gay because he liked to lift weights. "Men dont do that gay crap.".. was his response. Now everyone advocates weightlifting to keep strength into old age. Seventy years ago everyone thought pot made men rapists and made them give into their base personality. Whatever. I imagine TRT, in the future, will have the same evolution with anyone wanting a solid quality of life.
If you tried it and didnt like it then fine. If you want your body to be a temple then fine. But not at least looking into it with a critical eye...
Ther only points I agree with the naysayers is that too many people jump right on it without looking at the issue. And that anything in excess isnt healthy: TRT, food alchol, asprin...except maybe sex. Yeah Ill go with that last one.
LCSULLA - I think most of the people on this thread are completly uninformed and some maybe have their ego holding them back. "Im 60 and I dont need that stuff. I eat healthy and take my vitamins." LOL
Some of you remind me of my grandfather that use ask my cousin if he was gay because he liked to lift weights. "Men dont do that gay crap.".. was his response. Now everyone advocates weightlifting to keep strength into old age. Seventy years ago everyone thought pot made men rapists and made them give into their base personality. Whatever. I imagine TRT, in the future, will have the same evolution with anyone wanting a solid quality of life.
If you tried it and didnt like it then fine. If you want your body to be a temple then fine. But not at least looking into it with a critical eye...
Ther only points I agree with the naysayers is that too many people jump right on it without looking at the issue. And that anything in excess isnt healthy: TRT, food alchol, asprin...except maybe sex. Yeah Ill go with that last one.
Take your TRT. I for one never said I was against it, I simply said that the practice of it seems cost prohibitive for me, so that option is off the table. TRT, with sensible use- whatever that would mean- will undoubtably help any one with sustaining/gaining muscle, energy, stamina and low body fat. You may even feel those fast twitch muscles firing quicker during scrambles and things like that. As far as BJJ, I can't see anything beyond the mind being as ultimately responsible for the creativity and visualization of techniques and strategic thought processes required to make anyone better in that arena. As for the "my conscious is clear" comment, well that was pure satire. I find humor in the absurd...
I have never spoken to eddie about it 
circusmonkey -Fair enough.LCSULLA - I think most of the people on this thread are completly uninformed and some maybe have their ego holding them back. "Im 60 and I dont need that stuff. I eat healthy and take my vitamins." LOL
Some of you remind me of my grandfather that use ask my cousin if he was gay because he liked to lift weights. "Men dont do that gay crap.".. was his response. Now everyone advocates weightlifting to keep strength into old age. Seventy years ago everyone thought pot made men rapists and made them give into their base personality. Whatever. I imagine TRT, in the future, will have the same evolution with anyone wanting a solid quality of life.
If you tried it and didnt like it then fine. If you want your body to be a temple then fine. But not at least looking into it with a critical eye...
Ther only points I agree with the naysayers is that too many people jump right on it without looking at the issue. And that anything in excess isnt healthy: TRT, food alchol, asprin...except maybe sex. Yeah Ill go with that last one.
Take your TRT. I for one never said I was against it, I simply said that the practice of it seems cost prohibitive for me, so that option is off the table. TRT, with sensible use- whatever that would mean- will undoubtably help any one with sustaining/gaining muscle, energy, stamina and low body fat. You may even feel those fast twitch muscles firing quicker during scrambles and things like that. As far as BJJ, I can't see anything beyond the mind being as ultimately responsible for the creativity and visualization of techniques and strategic thought processes required to make anyone better in that arena. As for the "my conscious is clear" comment, well that was pure satire. I find humor in the absurd...
no way. dont fuck with mother nature. anything that can produce such miracle results will likely catch up with you. and remember that the medical communitiy didnt think for 50 years that anything was wrong with smoking.
of course you will find a doctor to write a scrip. i was on PED's for two weeks, felt so good i knew i had to get off them.
Five Year Blue Belt -Remember not to "fu*k with Mother Nature" when she gives you cancer, dementia, arthritis, heart disease, and high blood pressure too, okay?
no way. dont fuck with mother nature. anything that can produce such miracle results will likely catch up with you. and remember that the medical communitiy didnt think for 50 years that anything was wrong with smoking.
of course you will find a doctor to write a scrip. i was on PED's for two weeks, felt so good i knew i had to get off them.
If you get hit with any of that "natural" stuff, just sit back, and let Mother Nature do her thing.
12 - any of you guys doing hgh or trt.
my doctor said come in and take a blood and he would see if i need them.i didnt bring it up, my doctor did
My doc put me on them for 3 months after my back surgery. It really brought be back to life. However when i got off them i felt slow, tired and sluggish.
I am now on Joe's T+ drink. Shit works. Hit me up Ill give you some FREE samples from the shop.I wake up with serious morning wood every day from the stuff.
also I put my 78 year old dad on it and in 3 weeks he said morning wood everyday too!
Also estro blockers are good to take too.
On the Mat -12 - any of you guys doing hgh or trt.
my doctor said come in and take a blood and he would see if i need them.i didnt bring it up, my doctor did
My doc put me on them for 3 months after my back surgery. It really brought be back to life. However when i got off them i felt slow, tired and sluggish.
I am now on Joe's T+ drink. Shit works. Hit me up Ill give you some FREE samples from the shop.I wake up with serious morning wood every day from the stuff.
also I put my 78 year old dad on it and in 3 weeks he said morning wood everyday too!
Also estro blockers are good to take too.
yes,i think thats the mark, morning wood is the standard.will hit you up.thanks scotty
I don't think there really is a right or wrong answer to this topic. Every scenario will be different. I felt horrendous for several years in my late 30's and decided to get some blood work done. My result was 142.
I've never done steroids but have some of the other things that have been rumored to cause Low t (weight cutting, a few knocks to the head, etc). I wasn't living the healthiest but I also wasn't horrendous either.
I went on TRT to keep me in the range of 400 to 800. Had an MRI to ensure the root cause wasn't something with the physicality of the pituitary gland. If possible, finding and/or understanding the root cause should be important to anyone doing TRT.
After 12 months I haven't felt this good in 10 years. All of my quarterly blood work has come back perfect and many other measurements of health have improved significantly. Although this has been coupled with a big change in my diet and overall fitness.
Hywel Teague - I don't dispute there are people who have genuine medical conditions that require HRT ...This
But most people don't have them.
Eat shit, drink beer, smoke, live a sedentary life... Don't tell me you need TRT because you feel fatigued.
Work a 60 hour week, drink 10 cups of coffee a day, drink at weekends, train 3-5 times a week, juggle stressful job / family / life. You don't need TRT either. Tone back to what your body can handle. We're not supermen.
It's a crutch, like taking valium to sleep at night, or viagra to pop a hard-on. The truth is most people are not in NEED, they're just lazy and need to get their shit together.
On the Mat -12 - any of you guys doing hgh or trt.
my doctor said come in and take a blood and he would see if i need them.i didnt bring it up, my doctor did
My doc put me on them for 3 months after my back surgery. It really brought be back to life. However when i got off them i felt slow, tired and sluggish.
I am now on Joe's T+ drink. Shit works. Hit me up Ill give you some FREE samples from the shop.I wake up with serious morning wood every day from the stuff.
also I put my 78 year old dad on it and in 3 weeks he said morning wood everyday too!
Also estro blockers are good to take too.
It says to take it 30 minutes prior to a workout. I train at night and already have a hard time getting to sleep after. Is the T+ similar to a prework (will it give me a boost of energy immediately and keep me up after my training)?
Hywel Teague - Do you eat the right food? Get enough rest? Sleep properly?
Unless you're maxing out all these things TRT is just a crutch on which to support an unhealthy life
Prevention not cure, always.
Fix the problems in your life that cause your test to wane before running to the docs. It's like everyone over 30 now thinks they need to maintain the test levels of a 21 year old until death.
Why shouldn't a 30 year old have the same test levels as a 21 year old? I see declining levels as nature's fuck up that TRT is simply correcting. Given the opportunity, I'll certainly be happy with 21 year old test levels until death.
I've been on TRT for a while. I had pathetically low levels when I got tested. I was told it's the levels they see in 70+ year olds and I am 34. Whether it is genetic or semi-poor diet or whatever it was really really low. I didn't get on it for the athletic benefits (I don't lift weights, just do Jiu-Jitsu) it was more for the other benefits. I was havin' penis problems :) not anymore though.
I know about all the known risks and I have my levels and blood pressure and all that monitored more than needed to make sure I am keeping track of it.
I don't doubt that it has helped all aspects of my Jiu-Jitsu as I am not getting older and my students know I am on it and they give me shit about it, I don't keep it a secret.
I regret nothing