hubris - all of the morons complaining about Rousimar are fucking morons
they need to educate themselves or just not watch prize fights
do u train ? Im not an expert but am purple belt and have trained.Name calling doesnt prove anything.Thing is every fight its not only does he hold them after ( 11 taps this time )the refs verbal command isnt enough The ref literally has to pry his hands off the sub every single time NOte thats when he lets go.Also read what Murillo Bustamante his ex coach says ( few posts up )
Porkchop - lol he just completely ignored the actual problem in that comment.
The Paul Harris criticism comes from the submissions being held too long - not because they aren't pretty.
As a matter of fact I think they are pretty. I think they are masterful. He just holds on to them after the ref makes contact with him.
He compares it to Mark Hunt knocking someone out but he does it in the wrong way. For it to actually be comparable, he'd have to compare it to Mark Hunt continually punching the opponent in the face while the ref tries to physically pull him away.
We aren't talking about standard submissions and it never ceases to amaze me how these guys can so obviously act like they don't know what the real issue is....
Actually he addressed the issue of holding too long, saying that Palhares holds until the ref ends it, and that he released the hold within a moment of that.
Further, he said that the way Palhares applies submissions is like strikes, in that he applies them instantly with intent to damage. It's opponents that are too used to being given time and "the chance" to give up. With Palhares, if you wait, it's going to be too late.
He said by the time the opponents tap, the damage is done. So even if it's held too long, the damage was already done. The extra second or two didn't do the damage, the damage was done before Fitch even tapped.
Of course when you're the on the receiving end and you are injured, and someone holds the submission after you tap, you're going to freak out. But in reality, it didn't make a difference as far as the injury goes.
So yes, it's exactly like telling mark hunt not to hit so hard and accurately, because hey, you might lose consciousness or get injured. Just point fight me bro. Pull those punches.
The Sultan - Its his history that hurts him. Guys legs get fucked up when paul Harris gets a hold of them.
That said, he did not hold his last sub on fitch too long. I felt like he was fine.
Name one guy that needed.surgery after Palhares leg locked them. Tate, Nogueria, Sylvia all needed surgery after their sub losses. Why aren't Rousey and Mir held to the same standard?
B/c their opponents didn't tap.
Palhares is held to the "higher" standard b/c his opponents do tap.
Tate and (IIRC) Big Nog tapped after their arms were broken. Fitch also tapped after the break, which makes this analogous to Tate and Nog.
You can make a decent argument based on Paul Harris's previous matches, but he did nothing wrong this time.
There's no difference in this and a guy knocking someone out, and then getting 2-3 extra shots in when it's obvious his oppenent is out. He swings away until the ref has to jump between the guy so he'll stop hitting his opponent. It happens allllllllllllllll the time and no one cries about it. Hendo knocked Bisping out cold and it looked like he came off the top rope to land a completely unnecessary strike and no one said a word. In fact, people made memes and gifs and got satisfaction out of seeing Bisping get fucked up.
Paul Harris holds subs until the ref jumps between them. It's how subs are supposed to be done.
Plus your leg heals a lot better than your brain...
What Palhares does with his submissions is like the bomb Hendo landed to Bisping after he was already out at UFC 100. It was technically legal yes, because he landed it before the ref got there, but he didn't HAVE to do it.
I just hope that someday when Paul Harris is on the down side of his career some young cat catches him in a submission and breaks his shit in half. And I hope the referee fall asleep on the way over and whoever is attached to his broken limb shakes it like a Rottweiler shaking a chihuahua.
The wheel is always turning. I just hope someday he gets a taste of his own medicine.
EDIT: Just to clarify my feelings are not based on the Fitch fight, which was not as bad as many others... particularly the Drwal fight.
CaptainAhab - What Palhares does with his submissions is like the bomb Hendo landed to Bisping after he was already out at UFC 100. It was technically legal yes, because he landed it before the ref got there, but he didn't HAVE to do it.
I just hope that someday when Paul Harris is on the down side of his career some young cat catches him in a submission and breaks his shit in half. And I hope he referee fall asleep on the way over and whoever is attached to his broken limb shakes it like a Rottweiler shaking a chihuahua.
The wheel is always turning. I just hope someday he gets a taste of his own medicine.
The bomb that Hendo landed was a whole NEW attack that landed after Bisping was already unconscious. That's like saying that after Fitch tapped, Palhares switched to the other leg and broke that one too.
Face it, everyone who tapped to Palhares tapped after the damage was already done. His "holding it" didn't change anything.
Even in the gym, when someone is going after a heelhook and/or kneebar, you are playing a risky game trying to twist and spin your way out. It's a gamble, and you're relying on your training partner to be nice about it. But at some point it sticks and it's tendon destruction time, except that your partner is playing as nice as possible. Even then, the risks are so great that many gyms don't allow it.
In a FIGHT, and against a master technician and physical beast like Palhares, you have to let go of the preconceived notions and habits of gym training...of thinking you can fuck around when your knees and heels are getting attacked. If you don't want them shredded, you better tap and give up the fight as soon as he gets the position. Because every moment you play around when he's on your leg, you're at risk for instant damage. And that's on you.
It's not up to him to give you leeway and time to, "figure it out". Give up right away or takes your chances. But don't complain later. And as far as I know, I haven't heard Fitch complain.
Winston Wolf - nobody can answer me why does the ref have to pry his hands off the sub ? happens every time
since that in no way happened this time, or any time except that once, and since EVERY fighter on here has said it was fine, what in your head tells you that you are correct?
wrong watch again The ref clearly grabs his hands off the leg
Moke - Even in the gym, when someone is going after a heelhook and/or kneebar, you are playing a risky game trying to twist and spin your way out. It's a gamble, and you're relying on your training partner to be nice about it. But at some point it sticks and it's tendon destruction time, except that your partner is playing as nice as possible. Even then, the risks are so great that many gyms don't allow it.
In a FIGHT, and against a master technician and physical beast like Palhares, you have to let go of the preconceived notions and habits of gym training...of thinking you can fuck around when your knees and heels are getting attacked. If you don't want them shredded, you better tap and give up the fight as soon as he gets the position. Because every moment you play around when he's on your leg, you're at risk for instant damage. And that's on you.
It's not up to him to give you leeway and time to, "figure it out". Give up right away or takes your chances. But don't complain later. And as far as I know, I haven't heard Fitch complain.
Winston Wolf - nobody can answer me why does the ref have to pry his hands off the sub ? happens every time
since that in no way happened this time, or any time except that once, and since EVERY fighter on here has said it was fine, what in your head tells you that you are correct?
refs right hand grabs Palhares arm off the ankle watch again Very clear
Moke - Even in the gym, when someone is going after a heelhook and/or kneebar, you are playing a risky game trying to twist and spin your way out. It's a gamble, and you're relying on your training partner to be nice about it. But at some point it sticks and it's tendon destruction time, except that your partner is playing as nice as possible. Even then, the risks are so great that many gyms don't allow it.
In a FIGHT, and against a master technician and physical beast like Palhares, you have to let go of the preconceived notions and habits of gym training...of thinking you can fuck around when your knees and heels are getting attacked. If you don't want them shredded, you better tap and give up the fight as soon as he gets the position. Because every moment you play around when he's on your leg, you're at risk for instant damage. And that's on you.
It's not up to him to give you leeway and time to, "figure it out". Give up right away or takes your chances. But don't complain later. And as far as I know, I haven't heard Fitch complain.
he tapped literally 10 times
Tapping has nothing to do with it. I think the reason no one was answering your question is because the answer is so obvious. It's common knowledge that all the fighters are instructed not to stop until the ref stops the fight. They are instructed NOT to stop fighting when someone taps, and to only stop when the ref stops it.
As soon as the ref grabs Palhares, he releases. What exactly is the problem?
Like I said, when Palhares grabs your leg, you better tap EARLY so the ref has time to save you. Otherwise the risk is yours to take.
I agree with his manager on his submissions. They are very good and dangerous! But he still holds the submission after the referee steps in. That is everyone's complaint. Not that his submissions are to brutal.
Moke - Even in the gym, when someone is going after a heelhook and/or kneebar, you are playing a risky game trying to twist and spin your way out. It's a gamble, and you're relying on your training partner to be nice about it. But at some point it sticks and it's tendon destruction time, except that your partner is playing as nice as possible. Even then, the risks are so great that many gyms don't allow it.
In a FIGHT, and against a master technician and physical beast like Palhares, you have to let go of the preconceived notions and habits of gym training...of thinking you can fuck around when your knees and heels are getting attacked. If you don't want them shredded, you better tap and give up the fight as soon as he gets the position. Because every moment you play around when he's on your leg, you're at risk for instant damage. And that's on you.
It's not up to him to give you leeway and time to, "figure it out". Give up right away or takes your chances. But don't complain later. And as far as I know, I haven't heard Fitch complain.
he tapped literally 10 times
It's not the issue - the number of taps before the ref signals the fight is over is on the ref n not on palhares
The issue in the comment you replied to is how deep into the sub was Fitch at the time he tapped
