Had our first Puker!

Underground S&C Underground
41

Bah

Puking is like lifting to failure and muscle soreness. They can be used to gauge how hard you think your workout was but that doesn't mean you had a good workout. It all hinges on your goals. I don't puke anymore, I dry heave every now and then but I don't puke because I don't see a need to train that hard anymore but that's just me.

And the whole "reverse tabata" is to be able to generate maximal power. The problem with high rep work such as tabatas and various metcon workouts is that unless you couple them with some plyometric/dynamic work your explosiveness suffers.

But hell anyone worth their salt trains in various methods.

For example I gained around 15 pound 2 years ago and all I did was lift 3 days a week. I was stronger, I was fatter, and I felt like I was chained to the ground. A year later I reworked my training to include plyometrics, oly lift variations, and bodyweight work along with my standard strength training based off of Joe Defranco's Westside for Skinny Bastards. I gained back the weight I'd lost and was 10 lbs heavier than the previous year and felt like I could stand flat footed and jump over my house. I could stand flat footed and jump onto a picnic table at 195 and I could do the same thing at 235 2 years later.

Why in the hell does everything have to lead to so much drama?

And Joe Defranco is on of the best trainers around and he produces results. It's like Dan John said in an old Crossfit Live, the great thing about training athletes is that if you don't produce results you are out of a job. Which is why folks like Taku, Scrap, Ring Girl, Dan John, and Joe Defranco still have jobs.

Great job on a great workout Scrap.

Edit

And her is the full quote by Joe Defranco on puking in training. "Puking is one of the most catabolic things you can do to your body. If your goals are increased MUSCULAR STRENGTH AND/OR MUSCULAR HYPERTROPHY, you should do everything possible not to puke during your training!"

I don't think Scrap was working with this guy to make him bigger and stronger during this workout. So the Defranco doesn't really apply. I'm sure Joe would have a different opinion when it comes to conditioning his athletes.

42

I used to puke every time I worked out due to Ultimate Orange nausea. Quit using UO and never puked again.

I've heard that some internet marketing self-styled fitness guru is planning a realease of "The Lost Art of Combat Puking- Ancient Secrets of the Roman Vomitorium". I think he plans on selling it for 2K.

For some crossfitters, Puking is a right of passage. It is not the goal of every WOD and certainly not the goal of any trainer. You can eventually ralph so hard that you seperate your asophougus (sp?) from your stomach. Not a pretty sight.

43

Where's "Doctor" Jonwell when you need him?

44

Mule and Wizzle are correct, it comes down to what the purpose of the workout is.

45

You guys are right, it boils down to what the purpose of the workout is. I tell everyone that comes to this gym that if they're bodybuilders, mirror gazers, or someone into 1RM workouts, this is NOT the place for them.

Ralphy came back yesterday and knocked out the day's workout:

30 KB Swings

30 Pushups on rings

30 KB Lunges

30 Thrusters

30 Burpees

Took him about 14 minutes...a little drool, some profanity, but no puking. ;)

Puking is not necessary, by any means, it just happens sometimes.

SCRAP

46

good shit!!! you gotta push yorself beyond your current abilities thats how you get better, stronger and faster

47

Scrapper, where can I get more info on your gym, class schedules, etc?

48

"Puking is not necessary, by any means, it just happens sometimes."

But you're proud of it, otherwise you would not have posted this thread.

49

Joe DeFranco trains more than football players. He trains all types of athletes, and many pros at that.

I am unsure if he has trained a fighter, but, I would bet if he did, that fighter would be a strong one with excellent athleticism to complement that strength.

50

" that a one-time lift usually doesn't mean much with special operation personnel. "

Really? says who? and who really cares? Are you "special" op's? Why not? Even in "special" op's, and say street fighting, why would a person want / need conditioning? really? why? These specific types of situations should be over in seconds not 5 minute rounds in a ring under controlled conditions. Powerlifting, oly lifting suits these conditions perfectly.

It is easy to take complete newbies to training and have them make gains. Gains for new trainees, are almost guaranteed no matter what type of lifting or training program he/she is on. The body has to adapt to something it is not used to. What makes a good trainer stand out is one who can continue to help an elite(or better) athlete improve their speed/ power /strength as time goes on.....

And for the record, I have puked, 3 times in the last 13 years. I have never enjoyed it or felt good about it. I push myself all the time, just not to the macho point of purging. No need for it.

I do pull ups,dips, chins, lots of squats, lots of deads, lots of high pulls, lots of rows, lots of pushups etc etc......does that make me special ops material? lol

51

Really? says who? and who really cares? Are you "special" op's? Why not?

I was a Navy Diver for 10 years and I was stationed with the SEAL Team here in Hawaii for 4 years. I think I've got enough real time experience with those guys to KNOW and HAVE SEEN the guys that kick ass at their job ability and the ones that suffer.

Also, the people that "care" are the ones either DOING the job, or realizing that those guys are in insane shape and want to be like them.

When was the last time you saw a "powerlifting documentary" on the Discovery Channel?

Yea, you didn't. So I guess the question would be "who cares about powerlifting?"

Even in "special" op's, and say street fighting, why would a person want / need conditioning? really? why? These specific types of situations should be over in seconds not 5 minute rounds in a ring under controlled conditions.

Well, those of us that have actually served in special op units, competed in MMA, or other demanding sports KNOW that you need the type of conditioning that doesn't crap out in 5 seconds. You're just showing your stupidity.

Powerlifting, oly lifting suits these conditions perfectly.

Again, you have absolutely NO idea what you're talking about in this regard.

It is easy to take complete newbies to training and have them make gains. Gains for new trainees, are almost guaranteed no matter what type of lifting or training program he/she is on. The body has to adapt to something it is not used to. What makes a good trainer stand out is one who can continue to help an elite(or better) athlete improve their speed/ power /strength as time goes on.....

And how many people have you trained?

And for the record, I have puked, 3 times in the last 13 years. I have never enjoyed it or felt good about it. I push myself all the time, just not to the macho point of purging. No need for it.

Boy, you'd think that in all that time you'd have brushed up on your reading comprehension. Try to read the posts in the thread before coming on here just to read what you write.

I do pull ups,dips, chins, lots of squats, lots of deads, lots of high pulls, lots of rows, lots of pushups etc etc......does that make me special ops material? lol

HAHAHA! Man, you are either the biggest idiot on this forum since Caleb and his bigger biceps helping bench press nonsense, or you're a troll.

SCRAP

52

WOW....I am impressed!! YOu da man special ops guy.....lol.....where's the science in your training? Please explain then oh great one.

You only ASSUME powerlifting is the only sport I am or have been involved in......never ASS-U-ME.

I never claimed to be a trainer, but yes I have trained people that have asked me to with good success. I have however, developed programs based on the individual's goals, abilities, and current state of physical fitness, not arbitrary/random WOD's.....but then what do I know, I mean you are the "special op's guy" not me.....

53

Hmm, looks like my original response didn't get posted for some reason...guess I'll try it again:


WOW....I am impressed!! YOu da man special ops guy.....lol.....where's the science in your training? Please explain then oh great one.

The science in the training is the ability to get the job done. People that do this kind of stuff for a living KNOW that situations aren't handled the way YOU think they are.

You only ASSUME powerlifting is the only sport I am or have been involved in......never ASS-U-ME.

Really? Why don't you enlighten me on what you've actually done in your life. Are you going to smugly tell me that you're really an ex special forces commando, who sidelined as a powerlifter/bodybuilder, and you just came on this board to "test" me? HAHA!

I never claimed to be a trainer, but yes I have trained people that have asked me to with good success.

And people ask you for help because...drum roll...they are just SO impressed with your ability in the gym. Right?

I have however, developed programs based on the individual's goals, abilities, and current state of physical fitness, not arbitrary/random WOD's....

The people in my gym want to be in a certain kind of physical conditioning. Unless you were dropped on your head as a child, you would know that people are PAYING to train this way.

Since I've been posting on this forum, I've literally worked with thousands of people (since my workout sessions were mandatory for ALL Pearl Harbor personnel), answered countless emails, coached amateur and professional athletes, and worked with people wanting to get into special ops training.

I would say that I've developed training programs specific to the needs of my clients/customers/friends.

In case you're wondering, this IS the largest MMA site on the web. Why don't you make a post and ask how effective my workouts have been? I'm sure you'll be able to tell everyone what a lousy trainer I am.

but then what do I know, I mean you are the "special op's guy" not me.....

As I stated in my last post that didn't get posted: That's probably the smartest thing you've posted on this forum.

Go figure...

54

Shooter you keep talking about scientific methods in training, why don't you drop some science on us.

And you ask if your special ops material, I'm going to guess no, because you don't have the balls to push your self through that kind of training. What you call macho they call basic training.

55

Oh, and one other tidbit:

Why are BUD/s instructors adopting Crossfit style workouts instead of powerlifting and strictly O-lifts?

I'd also wonder how many special ops instructors you speak to on a regular basis.

I'll give you a hint: It's because "real world" operators have found that these types of workouts have a more practical carryover then bodybuilding, powerlifting, and long distance running programs do.

Unlike the "competitions" that you seem to degrade in some of your posts, not having the conditioning necessary to fulfill your obligated task in the "real world" can, literally, get you and other people killed.

In a nutshell: it's great if you can deadlift 2-3x your bodyweight one time.

It's also great if you can run a marathon.

Now, somewhere in between, you have to be able to do something close to BOTH of those things because you're in a position that requires endurance AND strength.

So, please tell us how you would accomplish both.

56

Scrapper hits back.

(and by that I mean grabs your head and knees you in the groin 87 times while Pantera blares in the background)

57

I am a SWAT operator and a former Marine infantryman. I used to lift heavy weights (bench, DL, squat) and run long distances for my training. I now do Crossfit-type workouts and my job performance has skyrocketed. I have never puked from a workout (I've come close; I'm just not much of a natural puker), but pushing ones self to the limit in Crossfit fashion is the best way for SF/SEAL/SWAT/Infantry types to train, IMO.

58

SCRAPPER and Golden Arm -

on a non-ignoramus note, how would you approach training for long military-style marches with equipment from your perspective?

since Crossfit doesn't seem to have you go more than 5K a session, how would you have someone train for that?

just doing a lot of marching with heavy equipment?

59

RoR,

To answer your question, basically, yes.

What I would do is choose a distance that I felt would be a typical "long military-style march", say 20 miles. I would walk that distance maybe 1 or 2 times a week, trying to take less time on each consecutive walk. Four miles an hour is a relatively brisk pace, so your initial goal would be to cover your 20 miles in 5 hours or less. Keep doing it until you reach a time that you absolutely cannot improve on, say 4 hours or a little more. Now get a rucksack, preferably with a good frame and a hip belt so the weight is not all on your shoulders and put a baggie with five lbs. of sand in it and continue doing your walks at the same fast pace(hauling ass), trying to maintain somewhat similar times to your best non-rucksack times.

Every week or two, add a 5 lbs. baggie to the load, and keep doing the distance at the fastest pace you can. When you are doing this with say, 80 lbs. in the rucksack and can cover the 20 miles in 5 hours I'd say you were pretty much ready.

Always carry band-aids, plastic skin, and mole skin in addition to a canteen or camelback hydration pack.

60

"SCRAPPER and Golden Arm -
on a non-ignoramus note, how would you approach training for long military-style marches with equipment from your perspective?

since Crossfit doesn't seem to have you go more than 5K a session, how would you have someone train for that?

just doing a lot of marching with heavy equipment?"

Yes. But you must take care of your feet.